INFO-VAX Wed, 19 Sep 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 511 Contents: Re: despair Re: despair HP 1/8 Gen 2 autoloader and VMS Itanium Re: Hypervisor Re: Hypervisor Re: Hypervisor Re: Impact VMS version on CPU speed Re: Impact VMS version on CPU speed Re: Impact VMS version on CPU speed Re: node and port alloclass, cannot add a node to the cluster Re: OPC on OpenVMS Re: tz88 - green-brick for BA350 shelf Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Re: VMS as hypervisor ? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Sep 2007 17:57:01 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: despair Message-ID: <5lahrdF7ce1fU1@mid.individual.net> In article <1190136586.142557.79670@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: > On Sep 18, 11:46 am, b...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: >> In article <1190128284.178297.247...@e34g2000pro.googlegroups.com>, >> AEF writes: >> >> >> >> > On Sep 18, 9:19 am, "David P. Murphy" wrote: >> >> On Sep 18, 8:28 am, AEF wrote: >> >> >> > I meant the fact that you didn't tell us that there was a problem. >> >> > IOW, I was referring to all the error messages, not just the last few >> >> > error messages. >> >> >> Surely an experienced person such as yourself saw them coming. >> >> >> > It seems to me that it was mostly the result of someone having used >> >> > the tape drive he shouldn't have, which, because even if the procedure >> >> > were written correctly the backup still would not have been done, >> >> > suggests that this ON ERROR THEN CONTINUE is not the biggest problem >> >> > at your site! >> >> >> > What does it matter? >> >> >> $ ON WARNING THEN GOTO ABORT >> >> $ ALLOCATE ... >> >> $ INIT ... >> >> $ BACKUP ... >> >> $ DEALLOCATE ... >> >> $ LOGOUT >> >> $! >> >> $ ABORT: >> >> $ MAIL /SUBJECT="URGENT! BACKUP FAILED!" NL: OPERATOR >> >> $ LOGOUT >> >> >> That's why. If the procedure is written correctly, then a human >> >> is notified of the inevitable problem. >> >> > This code doesn't even meet your own standards. Suppose MAIL fails. >> > Then it will go to the ABORT label and run MAIL again. In that case, >> > you'll be depending on the default error handler, ON ERROR THEN EXIT, >> > which will finally end it, and you'll be depending on LOGINOUT.EXE to >> > deallocate your drive. >> >> > And where is your cleanup! You didn't check if the drive is allocated >> > in the ABORT section, so again(!) you're depending on LOGOUT to >> > deallocate your drive. Horrors! >> >> > [...] >> >> >> I didn't bother adding error handling to that code because >> >> I realized that it would only be a *small* disaster if it failed." >> >> > If the result with correct programming is the same as with bad >> > programming, what does it matter? You should still fix the code and >> > fix the operations staff. Both need to be fixed in your case. >> >> > I SAID TO FIX THE BLOODY CODE. HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY THIS. >> > AND WARNING, I'VE GOT A LOT MORE UPPER CASE LETTERS IN MY ARSENEL. >> > ALMOST UNLIMITED, IN FACT! AND FIXING THE CODE STILL DOESN'T GET YOUR >> > BACKUP DONE IF SOME FOOL IS USING THE DRIVE TO BACKUP HIS STUPID VIDEO >> > GAMES OR WHAT NOT DURING SYSTEM-BACKUP TIME. >> >> > Besides, he did have error handling code: ON ERROR THEN CONTINUE. Yes, >> > it's bad, but it's still error handling. And I suspect that whoever >> > put it there thought it would act more like SET NOON. >> >> Grampa, tell me again about how bad all Unix programmers were and how >> great all VMS programmers were. :-) > > Whom are you talking to? I didn't write this code. I said it should be > fixed. I didn't say anything about VMS vs. Unix programmers. > You new here? There has been a long running (more than a decade at least) notion here that it is either the Operating System or the langauge that makes for bad programs. Unix and C are at the top of the list. I was merely trying to point out (once again) that it is totally the responsibility/fault of the programmer as this little snippet of DCL and the debate over its quality has demonstrated that bad code can even be created on VMS. Guess my comment was just a little too subtle. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 11:29:50 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: despair Message-ID: <1190140190.209242.275060@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com> On Sep 18, 1:57 pm, b...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: > In article <1190136586.142557.79...@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com>, > AEF writes: > > > > > On Sep 18, 11:46 am, b...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: > >> In article <1190128284.178297.247...@e34g2000pro.googlegroups.com>, > >> AEF writes: > > >> > On Sep 18, 9:19 am, "David P. Murphy" wrote: > >> >> On Sep 18, 8:28 am, AEF wrote: > > >> >> > I meant the fact that you didn't tell us that there was a problem. > >> >> > IOW, I was referring to all the error messages, not just the last few > >> >> > error messages. > > >> >> Surely an experienced person such as yourself saw them coming. > > >> >> > It seems to me that it was mostly the result of someone having used > >> >> > the tape drive he shouldn't have, which, because even if the procedure > >> >> > were written correctly the backup still would not have been done, > >> >> > suggests that this ON ERROR THEN CONTINUE is not the biggest problem > >> >> > at your site! > > >> >> > What does it matter? > > >> >> $ ON WARNING THEN GOTO ABORT > >> >> $ ALLOCATE ... > >> >> $ INIT ... > >> >> $ BACKUP ... > >> >> $ DEALLOCATE ... > >> >> $ LOGOUT > >> >> $! > >> >> $ ABORT: > >> >> $ MAIL /SUBJECT="URGENT! BACKUP FAILED!" NL: OPERATOR > >> >> $ LOGOUT > > >> >> That's why. If the procedure is written correctly, then a human > >> >> is notified of the inevitable problem. > > >> > This code doesn't even meet your own standards. Suppose MAIL fails. > >> > Then it will go to the ABORT label and run MAIL again. In that case, > >> > you'll be depending on the default error handler, ON ERROR THEN EXIT, > >> > which will finally end it, and you'll be depending on LOGINOUT.EXE to > >> > deallocate your drive. > > >> > And where is your cleanup! You didn't check if the drive is allocated > >> > in the ABORT section, so again(!) you're depending on LOGOUT to > >> > deallocate your drive. Horrors! > > >> > [...] > > >> >> I didn't bother adding error handling to that code because > >> >> I realized that it would only be a *small* disaster if it failed." > > >> > If the result with correct programming is the same as with bad > >> > programming, what does it matter? You should still fix the code and > >> > fix the operations staff. Both need to be fixed in your case. > > >> > I SAID TO FIX THE BLOODY CODE. HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY THIS. > >> > AND WARNING, I'VE GOT A LOT MORE UPPER CASE LETTERS IN MY ARSENEL. > >> > ALMOST UNLIMITED, IN FACT! AND FIXING THE CODE STILL DOESN'T GET YOUR > >> > BACKUP DONE IF SOME FOOL IS USING THE DRIVE TO BACKUP HIS STUPID VIDEO > >> > GAMES OR WHAT NOT DURING SYSTEM-BACKUP TIME. > > >> > Besides, he did have error handling code: ON ERROR THEN CONTINUE. Yes, > >> > it's bad, but it's still error handling. And I suspect that whoever > >> > put it there thought it would act more like SET NOON. > > >> Grampa, tell me again about how bad all Unix programmers were and how > >> great all VMS programmers were. :-) > > > Whom are you talking to? I didn't write this code. I said it should be > > fixed. I didn't say anything about VMS vs. Unix programmers. > > You new here? There has been a long running (more than a decade at > least) notion here that it is either the Operating System or the > langauge that makes for bad programs. Unix and C are at the top of > the list. I was merely trying to point out (once again) that it is > totally the responsibility/fault of the programmer as this little > snippet of DCL and the debate over its quality has demonstrated that > bad code can even be created on VMS. Bad code can be created anywhere, I'd think. But isn't it possible that some languages require more work and care to ensure quality code? > Guess my comment was just a little too subtle. Now just what do you mean by that? ;-) > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > b...@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 11:36:42 -0700 From: Rich Jordan Subject: HP 1/8 Gen 2 autoloader and VMS Itanium Message-ID: <1190140602.901437.277260@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> Running into yet another obfuscatory brick wall at the HP web site. Need to verify compatibility of the current Surestore 1/8 (gen 2) SDLT autoloader with OpenVMS and ABS, and the ability to control the tape robot from DCL via ABS. The EBS matrix only lists fiber channel cards for VMS, and no cross references for tape loaders. The OpenVMS SPD lists the previous generation 1/8 autoloader but not the gen 2; I could not find any reference to VMS compatibility on the 1/8 gen 2 page; it sent references to the EBS, which seems to be pretty useless for VMS. The VMS tape matrix referenced from the ABS page has totally contradictory information concerning the previous generation 1/8 autoloader (pre gen 2) where it states both "Integrity servers do NOT support direct attachment of ANY tape library." and "*** The 1/8 Autoloader is supported ONLY in a SCSI direct-attach configuration with AlphaServer systems and Integrity servers. " No mention of the gen2 device at all. Telephone pre-sales won't talk to me because its VMS (I think); I'd bet my call scares off the sales rep they referred me to but we'll see. So does anyone know if the gen2 device is supported with VMS on itanium? And can the robot be properly controlled from DCL or program by way of the ABS layered product? Thanks.. Rich ------------------------------ Date: 18 Sep 2007 17:58:38 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Hypervisor Message-ID: <5lahudF7ce1fU2@mid.individual.net> In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article <5ladeqF77o7eU1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >> >> How about "Control Program/Monitor"? >> > > Resource Sharing Executive - 64M+ I like it!!!!! bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 12:01:44 -0700 From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: Hypervisor Message-ID: <1190142104.060630.91870@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> On Sep 18, 12:33 pm, "Tom Linden" wrote: > On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 09:32:10 -0700, Doug Phillips > wrote: > > > How about 'Ubervisor' -- that rolls off the tongue nicely. > > Well it is a linguistic bastard, half german and half latin > Much like the English language! We could add some other language influences: Japanese: 'Ubervisor-san' -- the honorable person who maintains the Ubervisor. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 12:10:26 -0700 From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: Hypervisor Message-ID: <1190142626.883084.120440@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Sep 18, 12:06 pm, JF Mezei wrote: > Doug Phillips wrote: > > How about 'Ubervisor' -- that rolls off the tongue nicely. > > VMesse > > She's the mother who gives birth/supports multiple babies running on > her. :-) :-) > > (and with a cool reference to the original hypervisor, VM from IBM). Lose an "S" and it could be the Ubervisor's "language" -- VMese. I think we're on to something here. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 15:22:45 -0400 From: John Reagan Subject: Re: Impact VMS version on CPU speed Message-ID: wim.versteeg@ns.nl wrote: > We have two ES40's with each four CPU's. One with openVMS 7.1-2, the > other with openVMS 7.2.-1. For calculating the CPU speed we use a > command procedure named VUP.COM: > > > The VUP rating on the 7.1-2 system is 576.0. On the 7.2-1 system it is > just 261.8. When we install 7.1-2 on the second machine the VUP rating > is what we expect it to be, namely 576.0. We did the same test on a > couple of DS10's. The result is the same: the CPU speed on a 7.1-2 > system is about twice the speed of the CPU on a 7.2-1 system. Anybody > who has a clue ?? > > Wim Versteeg > Dutch Railways > Anything else slower? Just DCL? Do a C/FORTRAN/COBOL compilation and see if the compiler takes longer or not? Any different SYSGEN parameters like SYSTEM_CHECK turned on? -- John Reagan OpenVMS Pascal/Macro-32/COBOL Project Leader Hewlett-Packard Company ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 22:39:15 -0400 From: Robert Deininger Subject: Re: Impact VMS version on CPU speed Message-ID: In article <1190124978.800689.95180@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, wim.versteeg@ns.nl wrote: > We have two ES40's with each four CPU's. One with openVMS 7.1-2, the > other with openVMS 7.2.-1. For calculating the CPU speed we use a > command procedure named VUP.COM: > > $!---------------------------------------------------------------------- > $! VUP meter > $!---------------------------------------------------------------------- > $ say :== write sys$output > $ before_cputim = f$getjpi ("","cputim") > $ i = 1 > $ loop: > $ if i .gt. 1000 then goto endloop > $ a = i * 1000 + i > $ i = i + 1 > $ goto loop > $ ! > $ endloop: > $! > $ after_cputim = f$getjpi ("","cputim") > $ diff_cputim = after_cputim - before_cputim - 3 > $! > $ vup = (24*1200+diff_cputim/2)/diff_cputim > $ node = f$getsyi("nodename") > $ mtyp = f$getsyi("hw_name") > $ say f$fao("VUP rating for !AS (!AS) = !SL.!SL", - > node,mtyp,vup/10,vup-10*(vup/10)) > $! > $ exit > > The VUP rating on the 7.1-2 system is 576.0. On the 7.2-1 system it is > just 261.8. When we install 7.1-2 on the second machine the VUP rating > is what we expect it to be, namely 576.0. We did the same test on a > couple of DS10's. The result is the same: the CPU speed on a 7.1-2 > system is about twice the speed of the CPU on a 7.2-1 system. Anybody > who has a clue ?? It appears that your elapsed time is only a few clock ticks on this system, and the measurement error is not small compared to the quantity you are trying to measure. How many time did you run the measurement on each system? How did the results vary? I ran your procedure several times on a DS25: VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 1440.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 720.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 The difference between 1440.0 VUPs and 960 VUPs is 2 clock ticks, and the difference between 960 and 720 is 1 clock tick. To make this clear, I added some more output to your procedure: $ type show_vup.com $!---------------------------------------------------------------------- $! VUP meter $!---------------------------------------------------------------------- $ say :== write sys$output $ before_cputim = f$getjpi ("","cputim") $ i = 1 $ loop: $ if i .gt. 1000 then goto endloop $ a = i * 1000 + i $ i = i + 1 $ goto loop $ ! $ endloop: $! $ after_cputim = f$getjpi ("","cputim") $ diff_cputim = after_cputim - before_cputim - 3 $! $ vup = (24*1200+diff_cputim/2)/diff_cputim $ node = f$getsyi("nodename") $ mtyp = f$getsyi("hw_name") $ say f$fao("VUP rating for !AS (!AS) = !SL.!SL", - node,mtyp,vup/10,vup-10*(vup/10)) $ say "After CPUTIM: ",after_cputim $ say "Before CPUTIM: ",before_cputim $ say "Difference: ",diff_cputim $! $ exit ... and ran it a few times on the same system: $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 675 Before CPUTIM: 669 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 681 Before CPUTIM: 675 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 687 Before CPUTIM: 681 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 694 Before CPUTIM: 688 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 701 Before CPUTIM: 695 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 720.0 After CPUTIM: 708 Before CPUTIM: 701 Difference: 4 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 714 Before CPUTIM: 708 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 720 Before CPUTIM: 714 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 726 Before CPUTIM: 720 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 733 Before CPUTIM: 727 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 739 Before CPUTIM: 733 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 745 Before CPUTIM: 739 Difference: 3 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 960.0 After CPUTIM: 751 Before CPUTIM: 745 Difference: 3 (Note that the procedure reduces the actual difference by 3 ticks. I don't know what is intended by that.) These trials took 6 or 7 ticks (reported as 3 or 4 ticks, respectively). Then I changed two lines: $ if i .gt. 1000 then goto endloop changed to $ if i .gt. 10000 then goto endloop and $ vup = (24*1200+diff_cputim/2)/diff_cputim changed to $ vup = (24*12000+diff_cputim/2)/diff_cputim So roughly speaking, we increase the numerator and denominator each by a factor of 10. $ type show_vup.com $!---------------------------------------------------------------------- $! VUP meter $!---------------------------------------------------------------------- $ say :== write sys$output $ before_cputim = f$getjpi ("","cputim") $ i = 1 $ loop: $ if i .gt. 10000 then goto endloop $ a = i * 1000 + i $ i = i + 1 $ goto loop $ ! $ endloop: $! $ after_cputim = f$getjpi ("","cputim") $ diff_cputim = after_cputim - before_cputim - 3 $! $ vup = (24*12000+diff_cputim/2)/diff_cputim $ node = f$getsyi("nodename") $ mtyp = f$getsyi("hw_name") $ say f$fao("VUP rating for !AS (!AS) = !SL.!SL", - node,mtyp,vup/10,vup-10*(vup/10)) $ say "After CPUTIM: ",after_cputim $ say "Before CPUTIM: ",before_cputim $ say "Difference: ",diff_cputim $! $ exit Here are the results on the same system: $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 815 Before CPUTIM: 755 Difference: 57 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 875 Before CPUTIM: 815 Difference: 57 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 936 Before CPUTIM: 876 Difference: 57 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 997 Before CPUTIM: 937 Difference: 57 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 514.3 After CPUTIM: 1056 Before CPUTIM: 997 Difference: 56 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 1116 Before CPUTIM: 1056 Difference: 57 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 496.6 After CPUTIM: 1177 Before CPUTIM: 1116 Difference: 58 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 496.6 After CPUTIM: 1238 Before CPUTIM: 1177 Difference: 58 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 496.6 After CPUTIM: 1299 Before CPUTIM: 1238 Difference: 58 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 496.6 After CPUTIM: 1360 Before CPUTIM: 1299 Difference: 58 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 1420 Before CPUTIM: 1360 Difference: 57 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 1480 Before CPUTIM: 1420 Difference: 57 $ @show_vup VUP rating for BRAMHA (AlphaServer DS25) = 505.3 After CPUTIM: 1541 Before CPUTIM: 1481 Difference: 57 Try running the modified procedure on both systems several times. My guess is that you've uncovered a small difference in the overhead between the OS versions, and it changes your getjpi result by a tick or so on average. Your too-small measurement interval magnifies this difference, and makes it look like a significant difference in VUPs. Your procedure is almost certainly NOT measuring the CPU speed as represented by addition and multiplication. -- Robert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 23:23:33 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Impact VMS version on CPU speed Message-ID: <7108a$46f09637$cef8887a$21414@TEKSAVVY.COM> Robert Deininger wrote: > How many time did you run the measurement on each system? How did the > results vary? You need to SET PROC/PRIO=16 or higher in order to get any usable numbers. Otherwise the results vary depending on whatever else is running on the system. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 20:58:49 +0000 (UTC) From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) Subject: Re: node and port alloclass, cannot add a node to the cluster Message-ID: Anton Shterenlikht writes: >For instance, I've a 2node Alpha-I64 cluster even though I never >run CLUSTER_CONFIG.COM or CLUSTER_CONFIG_LAN.COM. Somehow the cluster >was formed, at least according to the startup messages and to the >outputs of SHOW CLUSTER or SHOW DEVICES commands. Neither did I >define any clusterwide logical names in SYLOGCALS.COM or elsewhere. >How could the cluster be formed? Is it really formed? If the SYSGEN parameter VAXCLUSTER is set right, the system will come up as a cluster. Whether it's a _usable_ cluster depends on other SYSGEN parameters, the existence and contents of CLUSTER_AUTHORIZE.DAT and other things. Often a misconfigured "cluster" will work just fine as a "cluster" of one node, but you won't get it working right when trying to add another node. >I now understand that actually one can only add a node of the same >architecture as that of a node on which CLUSTER_CONFIG.COM is run. >So is CLUSTER_CONFIG.COM irrelevant to a 2node Alpha-I64 cluster? Run CLUSTER_CONFIG on each node, making sure to specify the same or compatible settings (esp. the group and password in CLUSTER_AUTHORIZE.DAT) If you're running as a cluster but unsure how you got there, you may want to start over by cleaning out MODPARAMS.DAT, rebooting with VAXCLUSTER=0, and running CLUSTER_CONFIG to form a new cluster. You'll have to plan things such as how to make the disk with SYSUAF etc. available to all members even if not all are up etc. >The Cluster Systems manual recommends all clusterwide logical names >except LMF$LICENSE, NET$PROXY, and VMS$OBJECTS to be defined >in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM. However, on my alpha and I64 they are all >defined in SYLOGICALS.TEMPLATE. Is there not a contradiction? You are supposed to make your own SYLOGICALS.COM, using the .TEMPLATE as a starting point if you want. >I understood from Bob's reply that if I put the core system files >like e.g. SYSUAF.COM in SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE] on one node, then I only need >to define the clusterwide logical names on the other node. Is that >correct? Does it matter which node? If you want SYSUAF to reside somewhere other than what equates to SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE]SYSUAF.DAT, you'll have to define the logical, cluster or no cluster. >Simply having clusterwide logical names does not prevent from having >system files with different data on each node, or is that not a problem? You have to make all the logicals consistent, all point to the same place! >Why do the definitions in SYLOGICALS.TEMPLATE have /SYSTEM qualifiers: >$! DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXECUTIVE SYSUAF SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT >$! DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXECUTIVE SYSUAFALT SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAFALT.DAT >$! DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXECUTIVE SYSALF SYS$SYSTEM:SYSALF.DAT >Wouldn't /CLUSTER_SYSTEM be more appropriate? /CLUSTER_SYSTEM is quite new. /SYSTEM is nodewide, and must be done on each node. Again, each node's definition must be consistent with the others' (and reality). For example, perhaps you want all your clusterwide stuff like SYSUAF to reside on shadowset DSA1:. You'd want to do something like: $ DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXECUTIVE SYSUAF DSA1:[SYSTEM]SYSUAF.DAT on EACH node. Same for other things. Of course, you'll have to $ MOUNT/SYSTEM DSA1: first, as well. -Mike ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 21:18:19 +0100 From: "John Wallace" Subject: Re: OPC on OpenVMS Message-ID: <13f0ckoqhp70q4c@corp.supernews.com> "Jan-Erik Söderholm" wrote in message news:xVRHi.9071$ZA.4653@newsb.telia.net... > Walter Kuhn wrote: > > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/products/ips/opc/index.html > > http://www.opcfoundation.org/ > > > > Walter > > > > "Jan-Erik Söderholm" schrieb im Newsbeitrag > > news:78RHi.9070$ZA.4483@newsb.telia.net... > >> Richard Brodie wrote: > >>> "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote in message > >>> news:46EFCCBB.2010906@comcast.net... > >>> > >>>> What is "OPC"? > >>> Open Process Control. In a quest for a vendor neutral system for process > >>> control > >>> applications, manufacturers opted for an ActiveX based standard. Sadly, > >>> I'm not > >>> joking. > >> OK, thanks. > >> Now, a link/URL maybe ? > > > > > > OK. I64-only at the moment. No reason to dig into it > right now then... > > Jan-Erik. The particular piece of software being discussed here may be restricted to IA64 systems right now, but other OLE for Process Control-related software for OpenVMS has been around for a while now and doesn't necessarily have the same restrictions. OPC does occasionally get mentioned here on c.o.v. Keith Cayemberg's OpenVMS/OPC list posted here (from IBM) in Dec 2004 may not be all that current, but it shows the kind of players who were in the field at that time. See http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.vms/msg/be23d854653cd1f5 Outside the world of VMS, the www.OPCFoundation.org product database lists loads of other stuff, some from "device" vendors, some from "SCADA" vendors, and some from folks who (just ;)) know how to make things talk to each other. Mostly Windows based though. hth John ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 20:46:24 -0500 From: Michael Austin Subject: Re: tz88 - green-brick for BA350 shelf Message-ID: Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Michael Austin wrote: >> Does any one have one of these old devices they want to get rid of - >> cheaply? I have one that flashes all lights on the front after a >> power glitch. I had 2 in this shelf - and luckily only one of them >> got hit. I have tried re-seating and following the instructions to >> clear the error, but it looks like it is toast. >> >> Or if you just have the drive - I am sure my former DEC FS skills can >> take care of placing it into the canister. >> > You Said: > You don't NEED a new drive. All you need to do is replace the "Leader". > Note that this is a job normally done by field service. If you don't > know what you're doing, pay someone who does! > "Or if you just have the drive - I am sure my former DEC FS skills can take care of placing it into the canister. " I pioneered replacing the leader tape instead of the drive in the Dallas office back in the mid-80's working on TK50's. I got these for free and looks like I now know why. The ribbon cable in the back of this one was crimped/broken. Hopefully that is all that is wrong with it... I will take some time later to pull the other drive and replace it with this one to see if it is indeed just the cable. My guess is that the controller got fried- replaced a few of those in my time as well... Man - these parts dealers are not cheap - the ribbon cable goes from $145-$200. I hate putting money into something I got for free. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 11:49:28 -0700 From: Peter Weaver Subject: Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Message-ID: <1190141368.978629.176660@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com> John Vottero wrote: >... > Well, if you happen to be a third party software vendor that wants to > support many versions of VMS, you need to be running the oldest supported > version, the newest supported version and a few versions in between for VAX, > Alpha and IA64. It sure would be nice to do that with virtual machines. Very easy to do with CHARON-VAX and CHARON-AXP. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 11:49:28 -0700 From: Peter Weaver Subject: Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Message-ID: <1190141368.434744.45970@y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com> John Vottero wrote: >... > Well, if you happen to be a third party software vendor that wants to > support many versions of VMS, you need to be running the oldest supported > version, the newest supported version and a few versions in between for VAX, > Alpha and IA64. It sure would be nice to do that with virtual machines. Very easy to do with CHARON-VAX and CHARON-AXP. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 19:46:59 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Message-ID: In article <1190141368.434744.45970@y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com>, Peter Weaver writes: > > >John Vottero wrote: >>... >> Well, if you happen to be a third party software vendor that wants to >> support many versions of VMS, you need to be running the oldest supported >> version, the newest supported version and a few versions in between for VAX, >> Alpha and IA64. It sure would be nice to do that with virtual machines. > >Very easy to do with CHARON-VAX and CHARON-AXP. I would very much like to run CHARON-AXP but, alas, they chose to run it on a non-OS. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: 18 Sep 2007 15:47:58 -0500 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Message-ID: In article <1190141368.978629.176660@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com>, Peter Weaver writes: > John Vottero wrote: >>... >> Well, if you happen to be a third party software vendor that wants to >> support many versions of VMS, you need to be running the oldest supported >> version, the newest supported version and a few versions in between for VAX, >> Alpha and IA64. It sure would be nice to do that with virtual machines. > > Very easy to do with CHARON-VAX Not if your oldest supported version is V4.2 (the last I checked). > and CHARON-AXP. Not if you want to avoid Windows/Linux/Unix (the last I checked). ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 15:52:47 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: VMS as hypervisor ? Message-ID: On 09/18/07 14:46, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > In article , Peter Weaver writes: >> >> John Vottero wrote: >>> ... >>> Well, if you happen to be a third party software vendor that wants to >>> support many versions of VMS, you need to be running the oldest supported >>> version, the newest supported version and a few versions in between for VAX, >>> Alpha and IA64. It sure would be nice to do that with virtual machines. >> Very easy to do with CHARON-VAX and CHARON-AXP. > > I would very much like to run CHARON-AXP but, alas, they chose to run it > on a non-OS. Get over it (whatever "it" is) and do what you've got to do to make your life easier. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.511 ************************