INFO-VAX Sun, 12 Aug 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 440 Contents: Re: Is this Address really Illegal? Re: July the 4th OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Re: OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Re: OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Re: OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Re: TPU on MAC OS-X ? Re: TPU on MAC OS-X ? RE: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Re: X Window Servers Re: X Window Servers Re: X Window Servers Re: X Window Servers Re: X Window Servers Re: X Window Servers ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 06:02:38 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Is this Address really Illegal? Message-ID: On Sat, 11 Aug 2007 10:19:55 -0700, JF Mezei wrote: > Peter Weaver wrote: >> To: abuse.yy2118.com.cn,abuse.szx2118.com.cn >> %TCPIP-E-SMTP_BADADDR, recipient address is illegal; unparsed stri > > > I concur. Happnes on Alpha 8.3 as well. Even with > smtp%"abuse@2118.com.cn" > > HOWEVER, on VMS VMS 7.3 with TCPIP Services 5.3, it accepts the email > address. > > At the stage of foreign transport, it would be the TCPIP shareable image > which would be called to validate each email address. I suspect it > checks to see if first character for the host name is numeric and then > assumed the rest is all dotted decimal. Works with MX -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 10:19:24 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: July the 4th Message-ID: <1186939164.957991.303660@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> On Aug 12, 11:46 am, davi...@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: > In article <1186703159.436877.34...@q3g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: > >On Aug 9, 7:18 am, davi...@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: > >> In article <1186620249.987032.4...@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: > >> >On Aug 8, 11:18 am, davi...@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: > >> >> In article <1186442318.376946.4...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: > >> >> >On Aug 6, 11:12 am, davi...@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: > >> >> >> In article <1186363007.921609.27...@b79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes:>On Aug 5, 7:55 pm, davi...@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: > >> >> >> >> In article <1186334184.382451.138...@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: > > >> >> >> >> >[...] > > >> >> >[...discussion about the document about Israeli "racism" omitted, but > >> >> >referred to below...] > > >[...] > > >> >> >> >Well, if the Wikipedia article is right, even the Soviets (not > >> >> >> >normally Jew-friendly, BTW) considered the Arab invasion into the > >> >> >> >fledgling Israel to be _illegal_ aggression. > > >> >> >> Can you not read - I agreed that it was an agression as defined by the UN > >> >> >> charter. If you want I'll say it's an illegal agression as defined by the UN > >> >> >> charter. Any invasion of a sovereign nation is an illegal agression as defined > >> >> >> by the UN charter unless sanctioned by the UN. > > >> >> >OK, maybe I missed it. But you seemed to be saying it was justified. > > >> >> Apartheid was legal in South Africa. > > >> >My point was that even the Soviets thought it was, in their opinion, > >> >unjustified. Why else would they claim it was illegal? > > >> >> (You may say that OK Apartheid was legal in South Africa but South Africa was > >> >> just one country whereas the legal status of Israel was defined by the " > >> >> world community" via the UN. However imagine for a minute that Hitler had won > >> >> the second world war and along with Japan and Italy and a few others had > >> >> setup his own new league of nations. Would you then be arguing that the Jews > >> >> outside his immediate control should meekly submit to rulings against them > >> >> because those rules were passed legally by that world community ?) > > >> >Of course not. > > >> >This is patently absurd. First of all, if Hitler had won WWII he > >> >wouldn't have let the Jews live long enough to fight back. And exactly > >> >how would they have fought back? They'd probably all be dead before > >> >the conquest was finished. > > >> There were many in the British cabinet calling for a peace deal with Hiltler in > >> 1940. Only Winston Churchill's determination to continue to fight kept Britain > >> in the war. If such a peace deal had occurred Hitler would have had a free hand > >> on the continent and in his war against Russia later on. That would probably > >> have satisfied Hitler - He would have had his lebensraum. > >> However that would have still left Britain's Jews, America's Jews etc out of his > >> direct control. > > >Funny you should mention Russia. I believe Hitler and Stalin made a > >non-aggression pact, right? We all know how that turned out. Why would > >it be any different with Britain? The Nazis were pathogenic liars. > > Hitlers writings show that he had always admired Britain and really didn't want > to fight Britain. His writings also show that he always wanted to extend > Germany to the east and hated the communists. However it was to both Hitler and > Stalin's advantage at the time to make the pact. Making pacts and then breaking > them when the advantage changed was a normal feature of 19th and 20th century > politics and not something peculiar to Germany or Russia. You may have a point here, maybe. However, wasn't Stalin very surprised and outraged by Hitler's attack on Russia, thereby breaking the pact? And the Nazis were pathogenic liars. I don't trust those writings. It was also said that Hitler would be happy with the part of Czechoslovakia he insisted on annexing to Germany (Sudetenland). I believe British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain was involved with that, no? > Yes it is quite possible that after a period consolidating his gains in Europe > and Russia Hitler would then have launched an attack on Britain. On the other > hand it is quite possible that he wouldn't. With the success of fascism on the > continent it is quite possible to imagine fascism taking hold in Britain under > say Oswald Mosley and the BUF. > > >I don't know of any basis for deciding how far around the world Hitler > >would have gone to exterminate all the Jews. > > Why ? Hitler definitely wanted to rid Germany and the new German reich of Jewish > influence but wiping out Jews worldwide wasn't his or Germany's war aim. Certainly not his immediate aim but I wouldn't be surprised that had he won he would have eventually tried to. But this is merely speculation on my part. > If he could obtain peace whilst having complete control on the continent and > Russia then it is hard to imagine he wouldn't have accepted that. The axis > powers Military and Political power in such a new world order would almost > certainly mean that the ideas of the new reich would have a great influence > in the rest of the world. I find it highly disconcerting that you draw an analogy, parallel, or equivalence between a "League of Nations" composed of the Axis powers vs. that of the Allies. That's like equating a mass murderer with a Supreme Court justice or a policeman. Please. (I'm referring to your "However imagine for a minute that ..." paragraph above where you draw this "analogy" for the sake of argument.) The Allies weren't murdering Arabs en masse, for example. > Note. As well as the Jews Hitler also targetted other groups he felt were > undesirable. For instance the Romani/Gypsies who have arguably been treated far > worse throughout European history than the Jews (I don't know of any Jewish > groups held as slaves in recent history or tracked and killed like wild animals > in Gypsy hunts). Seehttp://www.dancekitten.com/gypsyinfo.html > Three quarters of the Romani population was wiped out in the holocaust but > their suffering was pretty much forgotten about after the war ended. But he hated the Jews the most, by far, I believe. And I don't see the relevance of your point here anyway. > >He might have gone to the > >ends of the Earth for all we know. He murdered 90% of all those Jews > >he had access to. > > Best estimates are 60-75%. > > see > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust#Victims_and_death_toll Still a pretty big number! > >This is supposed to be an acceptable loss according > >to you? > > How dare you ? > I can put up with a lot of your ignorance and bias but that is too much !!! Sorry, I meant this to be in response to your claim somewhere back in this thread that a people don't necessarily need their own country in order to defend themselves or that having such didn't necessarily help much so I thought you meant that it was no big deal if Europe's Jews were slaughtered en masse as there would still be a significant number of Jews left in America and Britain. I see now that I erred and that you didn't mean that. So I apologize. One more thing, though. There's ownership, and then there's sovereignty. The two are not the same. I still find it to be a big difference between the scenario in which the P's had their own country there just before the partition and the actual historical scenario with them being under British mandate. Additionally, there's a lot more to the story than you say in the first half of your question that ends with "What would you do if you were the Arabs?" > Write whatever you want. That is the end of this thread as far as I am > concerned. > > David Webb > Security team leader > CCSS > Middlesex University AEF ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 02:56:56 -0700 From: urbancamo Subject: OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Message-ID: <1186912616.102609.86840@b79g2000hse.googlegroups.com> Hi, I'm trying to do a standalone backup by booting off the OpenVMS 8.3 CD and backing up from drive DKA0: to DKA100: I get the following error: $$$ backup/image/verify dka0: dka100: %BACKUP-F-PARSE, error opening DKA0:[SYSEXE].; -RMS-E-DNR, device not ready, not mounted, or unavailable $$$ Relevant drives are: Device Device Error Volume Free Trans Mnt Name Status Count Label Blocks Count Cnt DKA0: Online 0 DKA100: Online 0 DKA400: Mounted wrtlck 0 ALPHA083 7965 81 1 This is on a DEC 3000/600 AXP, recently upgraded to 128 MB RAM :) Thanks for the help, Mark. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 12:09:08 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Message-ID: In article <1186912616.102609.86840@b79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, urbancamo wrote: > Hi, > > I'm trying to do a standalone backup by booting off the OpenVMS 8.3 CD > and backing up from drive DKA0: to DKA100: > > I get the following error: > > $$$ backup/image/verify dka0: dka100: > %BACKUP-F-PARSE, error opening DKA0:[SYSEXE].; > -RMS-E-DNR, device not ready, not mounted, or unavailable > $$$ > > Relevant drives are: > > Device Device Error Volume Free > Trans Mnt > Name Status Count Label Blocks > Count Cnt > DKA0: Online 0 > DKA100: Online 0 > DKA400: Mounted wrtlck 0 ALPHA083 > 7965 81 1 > > This is on a DEC 3000/600 AXP, recently upgraded to 128 MB RAM :) > You need to mount both disks first. For an image backup, the target must be mounted /FOREIGN: $$$ mount dka0: /over=id $$$ mount dka100: /foreign $$$ backup/image/verify dka0: dka100: -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 12:11:26 +0200 From: "Martin Vorlaender" Subject: Re: OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Message-ID: urbancamo wrote: > I'm trying to do a standalone backup by booting off the OpenVMS 8.3 CD= > and backing up from drive DKA0: to DKA100: > > I get the following error: > > $$$ backup/image/verify dka0: dka100: > %BACKUP-F-PARSE, error opening DKA0:[SYSEXE].; > -RMS-E-DNR, device not ready, not mounted, or unavailable > $$$ Try $$$ mount /override=3Dident dka0: $$$ mount /foreign dka100: $$$ backup/image/verify dka0: dka100: HTH, Martin -- = One OS to rule them all | Martin Vorlaender | OpenVMS rules! One OS to find them | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de One OS to bring them all | http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martin= v/ And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin.vorlaender@t-online.de ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 11:17:16 +0100 From: "R.A.Omond" Subject: Re: OpenVMS 8.3 Standalone backup error Message-ID: urbancamo wrote: > Hi, > > I'm trying to do a standalone backup by booting off the OpenVMS 8.3 CD > and backing up from drive DKA0: to DKA100: > > I get the following error: > > $$$ backup/image/verify dka0: dka100: > %BACKUP-F-PARSE, error opening DKA0:[SYSEXE].; > -RMS-E-DNR, device not ready, not mounted, or unavailable > $$$ Mark, you need to mount the 2 volumes first. $ mount/over=id/nowrite dka0: $ mount/foreign dka100: Then you do the backup. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 10:21:44 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: TPU on MAC OS-X ? Message-ID: In article <2721714.3M88bkd2e5@linux1.krischik.com>, Martin Krischik wrote: > > I never got Eve or LsEdit to display Black on Bright White - at least not > with the DecWindows interface. Both use some ugly green from the Motif > colour scheme. Are you using traditional DECwindows or CDE? I did manage once to get block on white for DECTerm sessions in CDE, though by trial and error using the color sliders. > > Apart from that: those in our team who want the named features either use > Vim or Ms-Windows UltraEdit (copying the sources back and forth from VMS). > Trust me. If you had been using either EDIT/EDT or TPU with the EDT keypad for as long as many of us here have, you'd be transferring Windows files to a VMS system to do your editing, not the other way around! (And yes, I have used UltraEdit on Windows, though I preferred a similar offering called TextPad myself.) -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 16:26:40 +0200 From: Martin Krischik Subject: Re: TPU on MAC OS-X ? Message-ID: <131899468.539oBBZa67@linux1.krischik.com> P. Sture wrote: > In article <2721714.3M88bkd2e5@linux1.krischik.com>, > Martin Krischik wrote: > >> >> I never got Eve or LsEdit to display Black on Bright White - at least not >> with the DecWindows interface. Both use some ugly green from the Motif >> colour scheme. > > Are you using traditional DECwindows or CDE? I did manage once to get > block on white for DECTerm sessions in CDE, though by trial and error > using the color sliders. Getting DecTerm to display black in bright white is not at all difficult. It mostly works the same way you get Xterm to display black in bright white. Just the name for the configuration file is different (DecW$DecTerminal.dat or so). Or you use the master configuration file DecW$XDefaults.Dat. What I meant is "SPAWN /NoWait Eve /Interface=DecWindows" or "SPAWN /NoWait LSEdit /Interface=DecWindows". As an old time user you might consider it strange but for learning you way around a new Editor drop down menu are indeed very helpfull. >> Apart from that: those in our team who want the named features either use >> Vim or Ms-Windows UltraEdit (copying the sources back and forth from >> VMS). > Trust me. If you had been using either EDIT/EDT or TPU with the EDT > keypad for as long as many of us here have, you'd be transferring > Windows files to a VMS system to do your editing, not the other way > around! (And yes, I have used UltraEdit on Windows, though I preferred a > similar offering called TextPad myself.) I believe you. Sure for an old time user both editors must be great as they come with a propper scripting language and after 20 years or so you must have a few 1000 lines of TPU code to make your live easy. Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net Ada programming at: http://ada.krischik.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 16:33:39 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: RE: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: In article <009001c7db10$23d108d0$6b731a70$@com>, "Paul Raulerson" writes: > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Bob Koehler [mailto:koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org] >> Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 3:39 PM >> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >> Subject: Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal >> champion >> >> In article , "Paul Raulerson" >> writes: >> > >> > You think that VMS has high security? Well, it does, but >> in = >> > part, that is security through obscurity. >> >> The only obscurity VMS depnds on is your password. > >Riiiight... that's why the bookstore shelves are loaded with books on VMS, >there are 7 or 8 magazines out there dedicated to OpenVMS and there are >several million installations of it... > It may seem a bit paradoxical but the reason why there haven't been tons of independently wriiten VMS books is that they weren't needed. VMS has always had tons of excellent documentation. If someone wanted to learn VMS then they could just read the VMS manuals. Hence the independent books have needed to provide something extra to justify someone purchasing them rather than using the standard documentation set. David Webb Security team leader CCSS Middlesex University >Okay, that's a little harsh, but the idea is still valid. > >-Paul > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 07:11:50 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: <46BEEAF6.1090304@comcast.net> Larry Kilgallen wrote: > In article <46BE22A7.6050105@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > > >>I've done controller (HSC) based volume shadowing, Host Based Volume >>Shadowing and hardware mirroring (HSZ based). I think I prefer the later! > > > That is the point - with VMS you get to choose. In other environments > people are forced down the hardware mirroring path. SOME other environments! Sun, for example, sells both hardware based RAID and software based RAID; e.g. Sun Volume Manager/Solstice Disk Suite and ZFS. If Microsoft supports software RAID, I have not heard of it! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 06:12:15 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: On Sat, 11 Aug 2007 16:03:58 -0700, Ron Johnson wrote: > On 08/11/07 16:13, Doug Phillips wrote: > [snip] >> >> Also in that era (80's), our DEC OEM-Rep once told us he'd just come >> from a meeting where a DEC VIP told everyone the Digital view of the >> future: 'someday soon there will be no mid-sized companies. There will >> be small companies that will buy PCs, and large companies that will >> buy VMS.' Our market then was small/mid-sized business with PDP and >> VAX (no PCs), and the rep told us we should either port our software >> to PCs, or bring it up to enterprise. Funny, I still see mid-sized >> businesses around, so I guess "someday" hasn't yet arrived. > > With gross idiocy like that, it's no wonder that DEC died out. > > How long has current VMS management been around? -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 09:05:14 -0700 From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: <1186934714.335210.79660@m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com> On Aug 11, 7:44 pm, "Paul Raulerson" wrote: > A fantastic summation Doug! > Thank you. > What do you think would happen if a third party offered to partner with HP > to port > VMS to a mainstream processor? I really don't know whether HP would be receptive or not. The third party (3p) would have to carry enough weight for HP to listen, and the 3p would have to have a compelling reason for wanting the port to happen. A media company or someone like an AOL or Google who has an Internet Application Service vision, maybe. I imagine it would have to be a current big VMS user who understands VMS' advantages, so I don't know. Ignoring the doomsday "VMS dies" scenario for now, I think the spin- off, break-off one is more likely, but an HP-sees-the-light one is most desirable. A few years ago, I could have come up with a few 3p's who might be so inclined, but Windows & *nix have grown up to the point that most of the reasons are gone. Back then I would have named Microsoft or one of the MS wanna-bees as most likely to buy VMS and port it to x86. No longer likely, though. The need for greater security, however will not go away, but will continue to grow. I think that as the world becomes even more connected, more applications with pieces running from the net rather than locally, browser and desktop more integrated, then OpenVMS should look more attractive at both ends of the scale. As long as Microsoft keeps struggling with security, and getting hammered in the press, that door is open. (Vista's "increased security" seems to mean constant clicking on "are you sure you want to do that?" which isn't really "built-in" security, is it? Well, there a few improvements and it comes with AV/AS active by default, but I turn off most of that and install my trusted favorites.) > x86 comes to mind, but if there were a spin > to address > the hardware sales angle, Power might be a tempting target. More like a VAX > than the > x86 is anyway... :) You mean "more like Alpha" I think? Power is RISC. I don't know Power intimately, but do I know it's a completely different beast. With Apple moving to X86-64, I can't guess what IBM's plans might be for Power. I know IBM is helping push x86 performance up the scale. If it were up to me (which it isn't) I wouldn't port to Power. Then again, I don't know how Cell might factor into it all. If the Intel Terra-scale stuff (discussed elsewhere) replaces both x86 and Itanium, it'll start at the top and flow down. And when it gets to a certain level of "down," it had better run the ton's of x86 software waiting there or it'll open the door again for the next (or this) AMD. Seems like x86 is the way to go. [harp begins playing in the background] If I could make a VMS wish and have it come true, I'd want it to run on X86 and I'd want to see at least a SOHO version sitting on the local computer store's shelf along side Windows, RH & the other Linixes(-ices?) at a competitive price. I'd like to see a polished OpenOffice (or something even better) and a lot of other OpenVMS/SOHO type software available OTS and even preloaded on a few PCs. I'd like to see a marketing/advertising blitz that would make people forget even the Mac and Win98 intro's. I'd like to see OpenVMS everwhere from the Desktop to the Data center, and when x86 rises to the top of the enterprise world, I'd like to see OpenVMS there and ready. [cymbals crash] [choir sings] "If wishes were fishes..." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 16:59:28 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: In article <1186753503.685906.257590@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, AEF writes: >On Aug 10, 7:39 am, Kilgal...@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote: >[...] >> >> As in any other computer system, that logical security can be achieved >> by logical people following logical rules. Rules abound, and if you >> follow the recommendations in the Guide to OpenVMS Security you will >> do well. For overall guidance (including people issues) I recommend >> NIST 800-53. The _only_ flaw I have seen when applying it to a VMS >> system is that it suggests minimum password lifetimes. Obviously the >> authors have been overly influenced by inferior operating systems. > >Hi Larry! > >My apologies in advance if this is a stupid question. > >What is the motivations for having a minimum password lifetime? Please >feel free to give a detailed answer. > The password history list on some OSs is so small (or non-existent) that there is a risk of a user keeping a favourite password forever by simply changing the password enough times and then changing it back to the original password. Hence these OSs implement a minimum password lifetime which means that after changing the password the user cannot change it again for a day or two. This has the unfortunate security consequence that if a user thinks that someone saw them typing in the new password when they changed it then they have to go to an administrator to change it again (or more probably to think - Did fred really see my password ? If he did I have to go to see my Manager ? No I'm sure he didn't. ) David Webb Security team leader CCSS Middlesex University >Thanks! > >[...] > >AEF > ------------------------------ Date: 12 Aug 2007 12:20:57 -0500 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: Wonderful things happen to an OS when it has an internal champion Message-ID: In article , david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk writes: > The password history list on some OSs is so small (or non-existent) that there > is a risk of a user keeping a favourite password forever by simply changing > the password enough times and then changing it back to the original password. The VMS system manager can make the password history list quite short, with a number like 3, but the user still will not be able to use that trick. Those who attempt it will be thrown into generated password mode. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 09:54:31 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: X Window Servers Message-ID: In article , VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > In article , "P. Sture" > writes: > > >** Some fun for the weekend:- The Gettysburg Address, done as a > >Powerpoint presentation: > > > >http://www.norvig.com/Gettysburg/ > > I came across this some time ago reading an article about how PowerPuke > presentations were dumbing us down. It's quite funny. > > One of the last DECUS events I did a presentation like at DECUS of olde. > I had code and overheards... nothing PowerPuke. When people came into > my session they remarks, "Wow, a real presentation". Afterwards, come > fellow came and asked me for the session notes so I handed him the set > of transparencies. He said, "No, I'm looking for your Power(Puke) on > a floppy or a CD." I said, "This is it, love it or leave it." He did > not take the transparencies. Next time have a few CDs containing the Gettysburg Address handy? :-) Old news I know, but this article is scary: tinyurl version: http://preview.tinyurl.com/9r28c ---- PowerPoint: Killer App? By Ruth Marcus Tuesday, August 30, 2005; Page A17 Did PowerPoint make the space shuttle crash? Could it doom another mission? Preposterous as this may sound, the ubiquitous Microsoft "presentation software" has twice been singled out for special criticism by task forces reviewing the space shuttle disaster. ---- And have NASA learnt their lesson from this? http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/topics.htm Distance learning for NASA students - all by PowerPoint -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: 12 Aug 2007 07:12:37 -0500 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: X Window Servers Message-ID: In article , "P. Sture" writes: > Next time have a few CDs containing the Gettysburg Address handy? :-) In MacOS Keynote format. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 14:09:24 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: X Window Servers Message-ID: In article <1186684006.675098.274930@d30g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, Lord Derigan writes: >Are there any free PC-based X servers that can can be used to create >windows on VMS and display them on a PC? The company I work for has >been using Himmingbird eXceed for a long time but will not purchase >additional licenses. I have someone who needs windowed access to our >VMS systems. I tried Cygwin, but I couldn't get it working. Any >other suggestions? Try Xming see http://www.straightrunning.com/XmingNotes/ David Webb Security team leader CCSS Middlesex University >-- >Brian Tillman > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 14:42:41 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: X Window Servers Message-ID: In article , VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >In article , "Brian Tillman" writes: >> >> >>"Bob Koehler" wrote in message >>news:rm2FYQdGSZCR@eisner.encompasserve.org... >> >>> 1) load cygwin (I think you already did), after all UNIX is better >>> than Windows >>> 2) start a cygwin shell (typically bash) >>> 3) execute /usr/bin/X11/startx >>> 4) ssh to VMS with X tunneling on (PuTTY does fine) >> >>Don't have SSH on the VMS system. >> >>> 5) mcr vue$master (or your other favorite starting point) >> >>SET DISPLAY/CREATE followed by CREATE/TERMINAL produced "no such display". > >If the X server is running, you should be able to issue: > >$ SET DISPLAY/CREATE/NODE=ip-of-pc/TRANSPORT=TCPIP > >Perhaps, you haven't enabled access to the X server from the machine. >What is the equivelant of xhost on Weendoze? > This probably doesn't apply to your systems but just in case. Also be aware of problems caused by firewalls or NAT devices between the two systems. If not using ssh tunnelling you need to allow port 6000 and possibly 6001, 6002 etc according to what you are doing from the VMS machine back to your PC. Also home NAT systems which map port numbers in order to allow multiple internal systems to appear to be coming from a single public IP address will also require port 6000 (6001, 6002 etc) to be explicitly statically mapped. David Webb Security team leader CCSS Middlesex University >-- >VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM > > "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" > >http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 17:48:23 +0200 From: Wilm Boerhout Subject: Re: X Window Servers Message-ID: <46bf2bd2$0$25477$ba620dc5@text.nova.planet.nl> on 9-8-2007 20:26 Lord Derigan wrote... > Are there any free PC-based X servers that can can be used to create > windows on VMS and display them on a PC? The company I work for has > been using Himmingbird eXceed for a long time but will not purchase > additional licenses. I have someone who needs windowed access to our > VMS systems. I tried Cygwin, but I couldn't get it working. Any > other suggestions? If the company you work for has at one time purchased a Pathworks for VMS license, the use of the eXcursion product that came with Pathworks is included in that license and may be distributed to as many PCs within the company as you like. I find that eXcursion is more friendly towards X-streams it gets from VMS than, for example, Xming. eXcursion works on various Windows versions up to and including XP Professional. I'm about to see whether it runs on Vista as well. /Wilm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 16:06:31 GMT From: "John E. Malmberg" Subject: Re: X Window Servers Message-ID: Wilm Boerhout wrote: > > If the company you work for has at one time purchased a Pathworks for > VMS license, the use of the eXcursion product that came with Pathworks > is included in that license and may be distributed to as many PCs within > the company as you like. There were two Pathworks licenses, the one for the PC utilities and one for the server. DECNET/LAT/eXcursion and the terminal emulator were in the PC utility package, most recently known as Pathworks 32. Pathworks 32 has always been licensed as a per-PC product. If a site had a site license like you described, it would have had to be a special contract with Digital/Compaq/HP. The eXcursion component was available for public download for a while, but was not licensed for use except for people who had purchased a Pathworks 32 license, and possibly a time limited evaluation period. Some Alpha Servers configurations came bundled with a specific number of Pathworks 32 licenses. > I find that eXcursion is more friendly towards X-streams it gets from > VMS than, for example, Xming. > > eXcursion works on various Windows versions up to and including XP > Professional. I'm about to see whether it runs on Vista as well. eXcursion is limited to displaying in 256 color mode. GTK+ 2.x and its X components currently require true-color to function. If you are displaying from a LINUX system, it is likely that a number of the programs will not display on eXcursion. The library in GTK+ 2.x fails with an access violation when attempting to connect render on an X server that is limited to 256 colors. -John wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.440 ************************