INFO-VAX Mon, 21 May 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 278 Contents: ANN: Xpdf v3.02 for OpenVMS/Alpha Re: ANN: Xpdf v3.02 for OpenVMS/Alpha Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Re: DS10L ATI 7500 PCI Graphics Problems Re: DS10L ATI 7500 PCI Graphics Problems Re: DS10L ATI 7500 PCI Graphics Problems Re: Free HP laptop wtih $10000 or higher purchase Re: How to have the exact DCPS version number Re: How to have the exact DCPS version number Re: Is VMS losing the Financial Sector, also? Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Re: New Zealnders now laughing at global warming Re: Noahs ark found! Re: Noahs ark found! Re: Paging Brian Roth Re: Thieving printer manufacturers was: Re: Shouldn't we be helping HP ? Re: Thieving printer manufacturers was: Re: Shouldn't we be helping HP ? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 09:44:39 -0400 From: Chip Coldwell Subject: ANN: Xpdf v3.02 for OpenVMS/Alpha Message-ID: I'm pleased to announce that there are fresh Xpdf 3.02 PCSI packages available for OpenVMS/Alpha at http://frank.harvard.edu/~coldwell/vms/xpdf.html or ftp://frank.harvard.edu/pub/coldwell/vms/xpdf/ This version of Xpdf contains numerous fixes and enhancements since 3.00 (the previous version that I packaged up for VMS); see http://www.foolabs.com/xpdf/CHANGES for a complete list. For users of my packages, the big news is that printing now works! When printing on Unix, Xpdf opens a pipe to a user-specified "print command" using the popen(3) library function and then writes the PostScript to the resulting FILE pointer, thereby sending it to the standard input of that command. One could probably emulate this behavior on VMS by specifying PRINT SYS$INPUT as the print command and using the popen library function that also exists in the VMS C run-time library. However, this seemed rather unnatural for VMS, so I modified the code so that the print dialog prompts the user for the name of a print queue instead of a print command, and then submits the postscript directly to that queue using SYS$SNDJBCW. If you leave the name of the queue blank and the logical name SYS$PRINT exists, then it submits the job to that queue. I'll zip up my source code and post it to the ftp site, also, if you want to build your own binaries. Aside from the changes described in the paragraph above, I made no alterations to source code, only to the build procedures. Chip -- Charles M. "Chip" Coldwell "Turn on, log in, tune out" ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:59:31 -0700 From: Rich Jordan Subject: Re: ANN: Xpdf v3.02 for OpenVMS/Alpha Message-ID: <1179763171.108088.186760@y2g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On May 21, 8:44 am, Chip Coldwell wrote: > I'm pleased to announce that there are fresh Xpdf 3.02 PCSI packages > available for OpenVMS/Alpha at > > http://frank.harvard.edu/~coldwell/vms/xpdf.html > > or > > ftp://frank.harvard.edu/pub/coldwell/vms/xpdf/ > > This version of Xpdf contains numerous fixes and enhancements since > 3.00 (the previous version that I packaged up for VMS); see > > http://www.foolabs.com/xpdf/CHANGES > > for a complete list. > > For users of my packages, the big news is that printing now works! > When printing on Unix, Xpdf opens a pipe to a user-specified "print > command" using the popen(3) library function and then writes the > PostScript to the resulting FILE pointer, thereby sending it to the > standard input of that command. One could probably emulate this > behavior on VMS by specifying PRINT SYS$INPUT as the print command and > using the popen library function that also exists in the VMS C > run-time library. However, this seemed rather unnatural for VMS, so I > modified the code so that the print dialog prompts the user for the > name of a print queue instead of a print command, and then submits the > postscript directly to that queue using SYS$SNDJBCW. If you leave the > name of the queue blank and the logical name SYS$PRINT exists, then it > submits the job to that queue. > > I'll zip up my source code and post it to the ftp site, also, if you > want to build your own binaries. Aside from the changes described in > the paragraph above, I made no alterations to source code, only to the > build procedures. > > Chip > > -- > Charles M. "Chip" Coldwell > "Turn on, log in, tune out" Chip, thanks for your efforts! I'm looking forward to trying it out. Rich ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 04:21:13 -0700 From: Andrew Subject: Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Message-ID: <1179746472.921463.178660@y2g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On 18 May, 16:58, "FredK" wrote: > "Andrew" wrote in message > > news:1179499122.866668.222840@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... > > > On 18 May, 14:41, "FredK" wrote: > >> "ChrisQuayle" wrote in message > > >>news:MBh3i.76$CE.9@newsfe5-win.ntli.net... > > > Odd, we have seen a number of large early Linux adopters quietly > > reversing out of their Linux strategy in favor of Solaris on x86 and > > increasingly Solaris on Sun x86 hardware. > > I'm sure you have Andrew. > You seem to forget that I no longer work for Sun nor do I hold any Sun stock. My observations on the demand for Solaris x86 as compared with Linux are based on what our customers are buying from us in terms of software. There is one very interesting difference between their Linux and Solaris x86 usage and that is they are happy to use Solaris x86 to support DBMS's where in the past most customers have not entrusted DBMS's to a Linux platform. It is clear that in their minds Solaris x86 plus commodity hardware provides a level of availability that Linux plus commodity hardware did not. > > > > Solaris really does have some unique capabilities when compared with > > Linux and thats what seems to be driving the change, that plus clever > > marketing by Sun. > > Really? Yes but since you don't appear to know much about either OS's further discussion is probably futile. Regards Andrew Harrison ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 05:42:32 -0700 From: Andrew Subject: Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Message-ID: <1179751352.340107.301090@b40g2000prd.googlegroups.com> On 19 May, 00:36, Bill Todd wrote: > FredK wrote: > > ... > > >> Solaris really does have some unique capabilities when compared with > >> Linux and thats what seems to be driving the change, that plus clever > >> marketing by Sun. > > > Really? > > Really. > > Unlike DECHPaq, whose last significant file system effort took place > over a decade ago with the introduction of AdvFS (RIP, Tru64) and whose > VMS file system offering has become positively antiquated, Solaris has > very recently introduced the most important new file system in the > entire industry since NetApp's WAFL (introduced at about the same time > AdvFS was). Solaris has efficient and effective software partitioning > in the form of 'zones'. Solaris appears to offer a significantly > broader and deeper range of development facilities than Linux does, > though I haven't investigated them in detail (yet). And Solaris has a > considerably better reputation for scaling and stability than Linux has. > > Just for starters, from someone not very familiar with the terrain. I'm > sure Andrew can flesh it out some more. > Apart from the examples you listed there is a whole list of interesting technologies in Solaris that Linux distributions would like to have but would struggle to implement or which they are scrambling to imitate. Dtrace is probably the most often quoted technology now being built into OS-X by Apple. The Solaris FireEngine TCP/IP stack and its packet classification engine. Crossbow network virtualization. Predictive Self Healing (the ability to recover from major component failures without a reboot (CPU's memory etc). Service Manager (grouping of apps/procs into services that you can monitor and control (stop, restart etc). Online hardware repair/replacement. Evaluated to EAL4+ (LSPP, CAPP and RBACPP) granted SLES and RedHat are being evaluated to EAL4+ but Solaris generally one or two steps ahead. To that you could add very very stable Kernel and User API and ABI's, backed up by the Solaris Binary Application Guarantee. These aren't exactly technology features but they are one very good reason why some customers are shifting away from Linux. You can of course run Linux applications directly on Solaris using Sun's Linux Container otherwise known as BrandZ. regards Andrew ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 05:50:49 -0700 From: Andrew Subject: Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Message-ID: <1179751848.606059.111890@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com> On 18 May, 22:19, "FredK" wrote: > "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote in messagenews:464E10DC.1050901@comcast.net... > > > gen...@marblecliff.com wrote: > >> On May 18, 10:38 am, Andrew wrote: > > > Sun says the software is free, the O/S, the compilers, and the development > > tools. If you want to develop software for the Sun platform, it costs you > > the salary of the programmers and the price of the machines they use. You > > want hardware support? It's available for a price. Do you want software > > support? It, too, is available for a price. > > Crazy like a fox! > > And yet Sun is still in financial limbo. Err no you are a bit behind the times. Sun is profitable and according IDC etc growing faster than the rest of the server market, they recently took back third place from Dell which they had lost 2 or 3 years ago. They have also retaken the number one spot in the UNIX market overall and the number one spot in the high end server market. Regards Andrew ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 05:55:19 -0700 From: Andrew Subject: Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Message-ID: <1179752118.786451.123640@n15g2000prd.googlegroups.com> On 18 May, 19:59, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote: > In article <1179499122.866668.222...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, Andrew writes: > > > > > Odd, we have seen a number of large early Linux adopters quietly > > reversing out of their Linux strategy in favor of Solaris on x86 and > > increasingly Solaris on Sun x86 hardware. > > And if they were moving off Solaris, would you be seeing them? I > think more likely they'd be seen by the vendor they're moving too. I don't work for Sun, I work for a software vendor who supplies products for Solaris, AIX, Linux, Windows, HP-UX, Tru64 and even OpenVMS. My point was based on what we are observing in terms of platforms that people are ordering our SW to run on. Regards Andrew Harrison ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:45:26 -0400 From: "John Smith" Subject: Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Message-ID: Main, Kerry wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: John Smith [mailto:a@nonymous.com] >> Sent: May 19, 2007 11:58 AM >> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >> Subject: Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? >> > > [snip ..] > > >> Why wasn't the new data warehousing initiative from HP targetted at >> VMS - >> just as a for instance? >> > > Simple. It's a NSK driven initiative with heavy customization of > non-top SQL. NSK is also shared nothing clustering. > > Pro's and cons like all architectures. So THERE's the value of actually owning a DBMS you can do anything to that you desire. It's almost like having a software portfolio and a value-added business model. -- OpenVMS - The never-advertised operating system with the dwindling ISV base. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 13:42:50 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Anyone know why the Alpha market is so so quiet? Message-ID: <953eb$4651da3f$cef8887a$13604@TEKSAVVY.COM> Andrew wrote: > You seem to forget that I no longer work for Sun nor do I hold any Sun > stock. My observations on the demand for Solaris x86 as compared with > Linux are based on what our customers are buying from us in terms of > software. You have to admit that you have kept a certain affinity to the Sun platform. And there is nothing wrong with that. Even when we are all forced to work on Windows with VMS long dead, the last crop of VMS loyalists will still extoll the vertues of their departed operating system for many years to come. And since Solaris is a great example of what HP should do to VMS (port it to 8086 and give it away for free), I think we can all humbly hope that HP follows in Sun's foot steps. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 05:35:10 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Message-ID: On Sun, 20 May 2007 15:21:23 -0700, tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote: > Refering to the banking and health-care, is VMS still used in the > space/astronomy field. I can recall once that there was some software > written for VMS in the space industry, but now its all for either SUN/ > Windows/Unix. > phillip > Yes, still a lot of VMS PL/I code at both NASA and ESA. -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:53:26 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Message-ID: In article <1179699683.511398.99630@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com>, "tomarsin2015@comcast.net" writes: > Refering to the banking and health-care, is VMS still used in the > space/astronomy field. I can recall once that there was some software > written for VMS in the space industry, but now its all for either SUN/ > Windows/Unix. > phillip I can tell you with absolute certainty that VMS is used every day in space and astronomy, and that much software written for VMS now runs on other platforms. ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 14:06:32 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Message-ID: <5bdnb8F2quu8oU1@mid.individual.net> In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article <1179699683.511398.99630@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com>, "tomarsin2015@comcast.net" writes: >> Refering to the banking and health-care, is VMS still used in the >> space/astronomy field. I can recall once that there was some software >> written for VMS in the space industry, but now its all for either SUN/ >> Windows/Unix. >> phillip > > I can tell you with absolute certainty that VMS is used every day in > space and astronomy, and that much software written for VMS now runs > on other platforms. Are they still running the PDP-11 they acquired a couple of years ago to interpret the telemetry from an ancient satellite? :-) bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:37:58 -0400 From: Chip Coldwell Subject: Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Message-ID: On Sun, 20 May 2007, tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote: > Refering to the banking and health-care, is VMS still used in the > space/astronomy field. I can recall once that there was some software > written for VMS in the space industry, but now its all for either SUN/ > Windows/Unix. I had a job interview at the Chandra X-Ray Observatory (actually a satellite) a few years back and they were running a mix of SGI Irix and VAX/VMS. The job was to port the Irix code to Linux -- they were keeping the VAX. Chip -- Charles M. "Chip" Coldwell "Turn on, log in, tune out" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 08:59:33 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Message-ID: On Mon, 21 May 2007 08:37:58 -0700, Chip Coldwell wrote: > On Sun, 20 May 2007, tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote: > >> Refering to the banking and health-care, is VMS still used in the >> space/astronomy field. I can recall once that there was some software >> written for VMS in the space industry, but now its all for either SUN/ >> Windows/Unix. > > I had a job interview at the Chandra X-Ray Observatory (actually a > satellite) a few years back and they were running a mix of SGI Irix and > VAX/VMS. The job was to port the Irix code to Linux -- they were keeping > the VAX. One of the NASA sites running a VAX6030 (PL/I code of course) have enough spares that they plan to keep the system operational until 2020. > > Chip > -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 12:02:16 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Message-ID: In article <5bdnb8F2quu8oU1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > > Are they still running the PDP-11 they acquired a couple of years ago > to interpret the telemetry from an ancient satellite? :-) Depends on who "they" are, and which PDP-11. I know of at least one case of a customer who refers to VAX 4000 as "PDP-11" because that's what he's used to seeing doing the work it's doing. ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 12:04:16 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Does NASA/JPL etc still use VMS? Message-ID: In article , "Tom Linden" writes: > > One of the NASA sites running a VAX6030 (PL/I code of course) have enough > spares that they plan to keep the system operational until 2020. > Why not? I've known NASA sites to keep IBM 360/75 going until the late 1980s, and a Xerox Sigma 5 about the same. I know another customer who just brought up an 11/785. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:29:35 GMT From: rdeininger@mindspringdot.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: DS10L ATI 7500 PCI Graphics Problems Message-ID: In article <1179683172.286806.191780@z24g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, urbancamo wrote: ... > Besides, I'm big >into LK201's instead of LK4xx's at the moment, so my DEC3000/600 >(which was running tru64 but which I plan to 'upgrade' to OpenVMS 8.3) >with 24-bit graphics looks like a better bet for an interactive box. Check the VMS release notes for V8.2. Some of the high-end Turbochannel graphics cards are only supported through V7.3-2 IIRC. You may not want to go all the way to V8.3 on the DEC 3000-600 system. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 08:54:16 -0400 From: "FredK" Subject: Re: DS10L ATI 7500 PCI Graphics Problems Message-ID: "Steven M. Schweda" wrote in message news:07052016133931_202002DA@antinode.org... > From: "Craig A. Berry" > > > As previously reported, "show config" at the console diaplays the PCI ID > info rather than the name, because the XP1000 firmware is too old to > recognize the card: > > 12 51571002/013B1002 > Correct. > >> My guess is that the device ID is something in Unicode, possibly >> Chinese. [...] > > It might be nice to know exactly about what you're talking. > A PCI device ID is made up of 4 parts in 2 longwords. Product ID, Vendor ID, Sub system vendor ID, and Sub system vendor ID. Generally speaking most devices are configured only by Device ID and Vendor ID - this is determined in SYS$CONFIG.DAT by a flag that can request a full 64-bit ID compare - and is usually only done when there is something really specific about a particular card. In the case above, the vendor is ATI (1002) and the Product ID is 5157 (an RV200 based R7500). In the case of 17: 4C571002/10021002 The Product ID if 4C57 is not recognized as a known device. A google search appears to list this as a "Radeon 7500 Mobility, 64 MB" that was sold by Dell. Kind of strange to find the laptop chip on a PCI card. Adding a configuration record to sys$config.dat in this case will not work (as was also reported). The device driver (GH) reads the device ID out itself because the driver must handle 3 different variations of chips from the family - the RV200 (full R7500), the R100 (the R7000 that lacks TCL 3D support) and the RN50 - which is a 2D only version. The R7000/RN50 are used as built in graphics on the Itanium. Each has specific capabilities and initialization requirements. So what happens is that the driver when setting up for the specific capabilities of the card - finds one that it has no information on - and fails the driver initialization. Unfortunately there isn't a clean way to let it drop into the path of least capabilities - because the initialization of an unknown card could hang the system. Is it possible that the device might work with the VMS driver/ddx? Perhaps. But not without figuring out it's capabilities and initialization requirements and adding it to the driver. ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 09:45:20 -0700 From: urbancamo Subject: Re: DS10L ATI 7500 PCI Graphics Problems Message-ID: <1179765920.306045.260370@b40g2000prd.googlegroups.com> Robert Deininger wrote: > In article <1179683172.286806.191780@z24g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, > urbancamo wrote: > > ... > > Besides, I'm big > >into LK201's instead of LK4xx's at the moment, so my DEC3000/600 > >(which was running tru64 but which I plan to 'upgrade' to OpenVMS 8.3) > >with 24-bit graphics looks like a better bet for an interactive box. > > Check the VMS release notes for V8.2. Some of the high-end Turbochannel > graphics cards are only supported through V7.3-2 IIRC. You may not want > to go all the way to V8.3 on the DEC 3000-600 system. >From previous posts I believe that the PMDG-BA that I have is supported but only in 2D mode. 24-bit 2D was the limit of my expectations, so hopefully I won't be dissapointed on that front. Thanks for the info, Mark ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:43:25 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Free HP laptop wtih $10000 or higher purchase Message-ID: In article , "David Turner, Island Computers US Corp" writes: > Get a free BRAND NEW HP Laptop with your next purchase of $10000 or more. > You guys will sell me $10000? At what rate? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:29:06 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: How to have the exact DCPS version number Message-ID: In article , Stephen Hoffman wrote: > Michel HERRSCHER wrote: > > > I have to check the version number of a running OpenVms Alpha. > > > > the command product show product * > ... > > no trace of DCPS.... > > Short Answer: Look in SYS$UPDATE:VMSINSTAL.HISTORY > > Long Answer: The DECprint Supervisor DCPS package switched from > VMSINSTAL kit installations to PCSI installations at the DCPS V2.4 > release, IIRC. Given the comparative antiquity of the (other) product > versions shown in the PCSI display, it's quite probable this system is > also running an older release of DCPS. > > I'd look over in SYS$UPDATE:VMSINSTAL.HISTORY for the installation data. > That file is the other place where these installation records are written. FWIW I recently created the little bit of DCL below, mainly because PRODUCT SHOW HISTORY doesn't have a /OUTPUT= qualifier: $! SYS$UPDATE:PRODUCT_HISTORY.COM $! ------------------------------ $! $! Produce a listing of PRODUCT SHOW HISTORY in $! SYS$UPDATE:PRODUCT.HISTORY $! $! Paul Sture 21-Mar-2007 Created $! $ history_file = "sys$update:product.history" $ create 'history_file' /prot=wo:re $ define /user sys$output 'history_file' $ product show history $ exit I currently run it manually after running PRODUCT INSTALL. I should really put it in a daily batch job or similar. The DCPS (or any other product) version identification problem then becomes a matter of $ search sys$update:*.history dcps -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 12:07:43 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: How to have the exact DCPS version number Message-ID: In article , "P. Sture" wrote: > In article , > Stephen Hoffman wrote: > > > Michel HERRSCHER wrote: > > > > > I have to check the version number of a running OpenVms Alpha. > > > > > > the command product show product * > > ... > > > no trace of DCPS.... > > > > Short Answer: Look in SYS$UPDATE:VMSINSTAL.HISTORY > > > > Long Answer: The DECprint Supervisor DCPS package switched from > > VMSINSTAL kit installations to PCSI installations at the DCPS V2.4 > > release, IIRC. Given the comparative antiquity of the (other) product > > versions shown in the PCSI display, it's quite probable this system is > > also running an older release of DCPS. > > > > I'd look over in SYS$UPDATE:VMSINSTAL.HISTORY for the installation data. > > That file is the other place where these installation records are written. > > FWIW I recently created the little bit of DCL below, mainly because > PRODUCT SHOW HISTORY doesn't have a /OUTPUT= qualifier: > > $! SYS$UPDATE:PRODUCT_HISTORY.COM > $! ------------------------------ > $! > $! Produce a listing of PRODUCT SHOW HISTORY in > $! SYS$UPDATE:PRODUCT.HISTORY > $! > $! Paul Sture 21-Mar-2007 Created > $! > $ history_file = "sys$update:product.history" > $ create 'history_file' /prot=wo:re > $ define /user sys$output 'history_file' > $ product show history > $ exit > > I currently run it manually after running PRODUCT INSTALL. I should > really put it in a daily batch job or similar. > > The DCPS (or any other product) version identification problem then > becomes a matter of > > $ search sys$update:*.history dcps Whoops. I should have put both the procedure and output file in SYS$COMMON. Here's the revised procedure: $! SYS$COMMON:[SYSUPD]:PRODUCT_HISTORY.COM $! --------------------------------------- $! $! Produce a listing of PRODUCT SHOW HISTORY in $! SYS$COMMON:[SYSUPD]PRODUCT.HISTORY $! $! Paul Sture 21-Mar-2007 Created $! $ history_file = "sys$common:[sysupd]product.history" $ create 'history_file' /prot=wo:re $ define /user sys$output 'history_file' $ product show history $ exit -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:35:53 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Is VMS losing the Financial Sector, also? Message-ID: In article <1179581177.359146.15810@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, ultradwc@gmail.com writes: > > no it does not ... this company obviously was brainwashed by IBM as > they never > went to alpha or itanium but are keeping IBM ... the vms port would be > a lot easier > if they just went to alpha or itanium, but they do not know what they > are doing and > have chosen to listen to outside sales people like many companies ... How much brainwashing does it take to be sure that IBM mainframes will be here tomorrow and be worried whether IA-64 will be? I don't know what VMS will be running on five years from now, and niether does that company. Its quite possible that by "VAX" they really meant VMS and are running on Alphas, I hear that all the time. While DEC would build a product and provide support for it decades later, HP's record has shown that it will not. When all the dust settles on what VMS' future will be then customers will look at it again as a long term platform. In the meantime HP has an "Alpha Retain Trust" program that PL/I shops can't trust. In their current state HP needs some heavy advertising to convince people that they don't need an IA-64 retain trust program. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:36:45 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Message-ID: In article <4650CBBA.6050905@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote: > tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote: > > Hello > > If anybody has the disc that I can borrow or sell I would really thank > > you. > > phillip > > I need the docs for DECfax V1.2 > > > > We heard you! It's not necessary to post it three times! This appears to be a common problem when using Google Groups for news group postings. -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:50:56 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Message-ID: In article <1179699239.728069.231400@x18g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, "tomarsin2015@comcast.net" writes: > Hello > If anybody has the disc that I can borrow or sell I would really thank > you. > phillip > I need the docs for DECfax V1.2 DECfax Mail V1.2? Drop me a line on Eisner and I'll see if I can get you just that document. ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:51:48 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Message-ID: In article <4651063A.7030102@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > > Well, he's getting zero copies from me. I have November but not > September and the listing that came with it doesn't say anything about > DEC FAX. It's my November issue that has DECfax Mail V1.2. ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 07:21:44 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Message-ID: <1179757303.893775.209640@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On May 21, 4:36 am, "P. Sture" wrote: > In article <4650CBBA.6050...@comcast.net>, > "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote: > > > tomarsin2...@comcast.net wrote: > > > Hello > > > If anybody has the disc that I can borrow or sell I would really thank > > > you. > > > phillip > > > I need the docs for DECfax V1.2 > > > We heard you! It's not necessary to post it three times! > > This appears to be a common problem when using Google Groups for news > group postings. > > -- > Paul Sture Really? Really? Really? Really, I rarely have that problem with Google Groups. I have a lot of other problems with it, though! The lastest one is that it has trouble counting posts. AEF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:27:53 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Message-ID: <4651AC69.70807@comcast.net> Bob Koehler wrote: > In article <4651063A.7030102@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > >>Well, he's getting zero copies from me. I have November but not >>September and the listing that came with it doesn't say anything about >>DEC FAX. > > > It's my November issue that has DECfax Mail V1.2. > From the "OpenVMS_AXP Software Product Library_____ Master Index" November 1994, AV-QEPEA-XE: "DEC Distributed Queuing Service for OpenVMS AXP DEC/EDI for OpenVMS AXP DEC FMS for OpenVMS AXP" DEC FAX, if present, should have been listed between the two foregoing entries. Or am I missing something? ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 12:00:45 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: looking for the on-line documentation for september 1994 Message-ID: In article <4651AC69.70807@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > From the "OpenVMS_AXP Software Product Library_____ Master Index" > November 1994, AV-QEPEA-XE: > "DEC Distributed Queuing Service for OpenVMS AXP > DEC/EDI for OpenVMS AXP > DEC FMS for OpenVMS AXP" > > DEC FAX, if present, should have been listed between the two foregoing > entries. Or am I missing something? DECfax is not listed as DEC FAX, and the Condist holds the binaries, not the doc set, which is what the OP asked for. ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 06:14:52 -0700 From: Andrew Subject: Re: New Zealnders now laughing at global warming Message-ID: <1179753292.626200.151490@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com> On 19 May, 02:41, "Dr. Dweeb" wrote: > ultra...@gmail.com wrote: > >http://www.stuff.co.nz/timaruherald/4064691a6571.html > > Naturally. This is the position of all those capable of reading the science > and who do not have a vested interest in the promulgation of the > politically correct (but scientifically, totally unsupportable) line. > > AGW is irrelevant, on a global scale. > > There are so many environmental issues which *are* relevant and which can be > addressed, that it is truly sadenning to see the obsession with the > pointless and urrelevant (CO2 volume) issue. It is based on non-science and > detracts from the real issues at hand. :( > > But hey, what do I know, my mentors in this field are merely scientiests > with extremely high credibility who have chosen to keep their own counsel. > They laugh at Al Gore and his polemic, as I do, and for the same reasons. > > Dweeb I would suggest http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/dn11462 You are perplexed and as you can see from the title the article may help. BTW. For every "credible" scientist that has laughed at the IPCC report because places too much emphasis on mans impact on GW there are many many more who are complaining that the reports pulled their punches because of pressure from large carbon producing and consuming countries. Regards Andrew Harrison ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:11:37 -0700 From: Andrew Subject: Re: Noahs ark found! Message-ID: <1179760297.803505.65120@36g2000prm.googlegroups.com> On 30 Apr, 15:25, Dirk Munk wrote: > gen...@marblecliff.com wrote: > > the same researcher who helped bring about the discovery > > of Mount Sinai now believes he has found Noahs ark on a > > mountain in Iran ... scroll to the bottom and look at the > > pictures and video ... > > >http://www.arkfever.com/ > > This time Boob is right. What you see on the pictures is the stern of > the ark. On it they found the inscription "Noahs Ark - Monrovia" in > Hebrew. That proofs Boob is not mistaken this time. Thats what you get if you register your ark under a flag of convenience, wildly off course and stuck up a mountain with no navigable water in site. Regards Andrew Harrison ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:56:11 -0400 From: "FredK" Subject: Re: Noahs ark found! Message-ID: "Andrew" wrote in message news:1179760297.803505.65120@36g2000prm.googlegroups.com... > On 30 Apr, 15:25, Dirk Munk wrote: >> gen...@marblecliff.com wrote: >> > the same researcher who helped bring about the discovery >> > of Mount Sinai now believes he has found Noahs ark on a >> > mountain in Iran ... scroll to the bottom and look at the >> > pictures and video ... >> >> >http://www.arkfever.com/ >> >> This time Boob is right. What you see on the pictures is the stern of >> the ark. On it they found the inscription "Noahs Ark - Monrovia" in >> Hebrew. That proofs Boob is not mistaken this time. > > Thats what you get if you register your ark under a flag of > convenience, wildly off course and stuck up a mountain with no > navigable water in site. > That was the best thing ever written in this thread. Sigh. Why do people insist on discussing politics and religion in groups like this? - I have not once seen someones mind changed. - At best you get those who agree with you agreeing. - At worst, you will be exposed as an idiot. There *are* forums devoted to almost anything. You can find lots of people who agree with you, without risking ridicule from people you may need to interact with professionally. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:35:56 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: Paging Brian Roth Message-ID: In article , John Santos wrote: > In article <464B9220.216AD4C9@spam.comcast.net>, > djesys.no@spam.comcast.net says... > > Bill Gunshannon wrote: > > > > > > Sorry to disturb the group, but emails to Brian don't seem to > > > be getting there for some reason. Brian was the one coming for > > > another of the VAX 7000's but he didn't show up this weekend and > > > I can't seem to contact him. And all this stuff is getting closer > > > to the landfill every day. > > > > Does the floor tilt toward the landfill? > > > > Does the building vibrate causing things to slide in that direction? > > > > > > Bill is in Scranton... Check out coal mine fires. :-( Ouch. I once worked with a guy who had an unsaleable house due to mining subsidence. He was going through the process of suing the UK Coal Board the last time I heard. Not an easy process apparently. -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 12:07:08 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: Thieving printer manufacturers was: Re: Shouldn't we be helping HP ? Message-ID: <00A67F07.7D88E77E@SendSpamHere.ORG> In article , Tad Winters writes: > > >"johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" wrote in >news:1179506738.264108.280180@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com: > >> On May 18, 12:16 pm, Doug Phillips wrote: >>> On May 17, 4:53 pm, Keith Parris wrote: >>> >>> > Doug Phillips wrote: >>> > > I recently bought a Canon MP830 and I'm very impressed with it >after >>> > > using HP for years. It has individual photo/color cartridges >(Black, >>> > > Yellow, Magenta, Cyan) >>> >>> > HP also sells some printer models with individual cartridges for >each >>> > color of ink. >>> >>> Didn't say they didn't, but so what if they do? I was talking about >>> the Canon MP830. I liked the fact that the Canon has a 2nd larger >>> black cartridge. The HP's I saw use a single black cartridge for both >>> photo and text. I didn't make comparisons between the two other than >>> that Canon lacked a NIC, but please do tell us about your comparably >>> priced HP Multi-Function. >> >> I recently bought a printer for my wife and I looked hard at the Canon >> MP830 and the MP960 but ended up with an HP C6180. I really didn't >> want to go with the HP because we had a multitude of driver problems >> on her Win2K system with an HP 2110 AIO. I also had reservations >> about the Canon products since we had a bad experience with a MP130 >> (Constant paper jams and cock-eyed printing). I did a lot of looking >> in the help forums various places and nobody was reporting any >> problems with the drivers for these (We print from Mac OS X and >> Windows). The MP960, while nice, was a bit pricey at the time ($499 >> most places) and the MP830 just didn't feel as easy to use. So we got >> the C6180 at MicroCenter for $259 (plus tax). So far no complaints. >> We have printed about 300 pages on it without problems and haven't had >> the driver issues like before. We've done a little scanning and >> copying also. >> >> My wife prints to it from her Win2k PC and the kids print from their >> Mac Mini. I have the HP LJ4050 and not much need for color so I >> haven't tried printing with my Mac Pro or even from VMS (via LPR and a >> Mac, I suppose). >> >> The HP c6180 is a 6-color photo printer with fax/scanner/copier >> functions. Each color has its own cartridge and the black is around >> twice as big as the other colors. Retail for each color cartridge is >> $9.95 and the black is $14.95. You can get discounts at Sam's Club >> and other places. >> >> John H. Reinhardt >> > >Really nice, complete review. > >Since this appears to be _the_ printer review thread, I'll toss one in >too. About a year and a half ago, we I finally got fed up with buying >expensive new ink cartridges, defective refilled cartridges and >performing the messy job of refilling cartridges. My wife complained >about not getting photos to print correctly and the kids always seemed to >be printing like crazy as soon as the printer was working again. On top >of that, my computer had to be on so others could print. > >We went out and looked at new printers. I was interested in a laser, but >my wife wanted to be able to print color photos. The next day, I went >back to the office store and brought home a Konica-Minolta Magicolor >2430DL. I hooked it up to the network and installed drivers for Windows >XP, Windows XP X64 Professional, and Windows 2000. We had no problems >printing. A week later, I installed a driver on a Mac running OS 9. >Last fall, I installed a driver for a newly installed Linux box. It has >handled well. The kids have printed huge amounts for homework. My wife >has printed some photos. (She's been to busy working at the kids school >to get back to her scrapbooking.) I've printed plenty myself. > >At about the one year mark, it ran the black toner dry. (I had about 3 >weeks warning.) The new black toner cartridge was $65. I had no problem >with that price since I'd been spending over $100 a year on the old >inkjet printers. Of course the laser prints much faster, and is >available to all the computers without my computer being in the loop. > >As I recall, it's had only 2 real paper jams. All the others were >cleared by my opening the top cover to look for problems. My daughter's >laptop appears to often cause the printer to get a video underrun error, >if she prints a PDF from within a browser window. That's strange. The >laptop itself is pretty slow. She knows she can save the PDF locally and >then open it with the Adobe Reader application and then print it fine. > >Oops. I don't want to forget the price. It was $279. The only time >since then that I've seen it that cheap was as a refurb at Fry's, where >is was actually $180. IIRC, my LNCO2 was a d|i|g|i|t|a|l branded Minolta. Paul Anderson will correct me if I am wrong. It's postscript and prints using a fuser oil which makes its output pages look like magazine print. I really loved it and wish I could still use it considering the $4K I paid for it. Alas, HP dumped it so they could push their printers exclusively. I see no reason to retire a quality bit of working kit and supplant it with HP kit just to bolster someone elses retirement pension fund. I don't/won't have one so any money I save is welcome. HP have pissed me off so in this regard that I will NEVER EVER purchase and HP printer or any type. I even work to dissuade others from such a purchase. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" ------------------------------ Date: 21 May 2007 08:42:05 -0700 From: Rich Jordan Subject: Re: Thieving printer manufacturers was: Re: Shouldn't we be helping HP ? Message-ID: <1179762125.450547.216850@z24g2000prd.googlegroups.com> On May 21, 7:07 am, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > In article , Tad Winters writes: > > > > > > >"johnhreinha...@yahoo.com" wrote in > >news:1179506738.264108.280180@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com: > > >> On May 18, 12:16 pm, Doug Phillips wrote: > >>> On May 17, 4:53 pm, Keith Parris wrote: > > >>> > Doug Phillips wrote: > >>> > > I recently bought a Canon MP830 and I'm very impressed with it > >after > >>> > > using HP for years. It has individual photo/color cartridges > >(Black, > >>> > > Yellow, Magenta, Cyan) > > >>> > HP also sells some printer models with individual cartridges for > >each > >>> > color of ink. > > >>> Didn't say they didn't, but so what if they do? I was talking about > >>> the Canon MP830. I liked the fact that the Canon has a 2nd larger > >>> black cartridge. The HP's I saw use a single black cartridge for both > >>> photo and text. I didn't make comparisons between the two other than > >>> that Canon lacked a NIC, but please do tell us about your comparably > >>> priced HP Multi-Function. > > >> I recently bought a printer for my wife and I looked hard at the Canon > >> MP830 and the MP960 but ended up with an HP C6180. I really didn't > >> want to go with the HP because we had a multitude of driver problems > >> on her Win2K system with an HP 2110 AIO. I also had reservations > >> about the Canon products since we had a bad experience with a MP130 > >> (Constant paper jams and cock-eyed printing). I did a lot of looking > >> in the help forums various places and nobody was reporting any > >> problems with the drivers for these (We print from Mac OS X and > >> Windows). The MP960, while nice, was a bit pricey at the time ($499 > >> most places) and the MP830 just didn't feel as easy to use. So we got > >> the C6180 at MicroCenter for $259 (plus tax). So far no complaints. > >> We have printed about 300 pages on it without problems and haven't had > >> the driver issues like before. We've done a little scanning and > >> copying also. > > >> My wife prints to it from her Win2k PC and the kids print from their > >> Mac Mini. I have the HP LJ4050 and not much need for color so I > >> haven't tried printing with my Mac Pro or even from VMS (via LPR and a > >> Mac, I suppose). > > >> The HP c6180 is a 6-color photo printer with fax/scanner/copier > >> functions. Each color has its own cartridge and the black is around > >> twice as big as the other colors. Retail for each color cartridge is > >> $9.95 and the black is $14.95. You can get discounts at Sam's Club > >> and other places. > > >> John H. Reinhardt > > >Really nice, complete review. > > >Since this appears to be _the_ printer review thread, I'll toss one in > >too. About a year and a half ago, we I finally got fed up with buying > >expensive new ink cartridges, defective refilled cartridges and > >performing the messy job of refilling cartridges. My wife complained > >about not getting photos to print correctly and the kids always seemed to > >be printing like crazy as soon as the printer was working again. On top > >of that, my computer had to be on so others could print. > > >We went out and looked at new printers. I was interested in a laser, but > >my wife wanted to be able to print color photos. The next day, I went > >back to the office store and brought home a Konica-Minolta Magicolor > >2430DL. I hooked it up to the network and installed drivers for Windows > >XP, Windows XP X64 Professional, and Windows 2000. We had no problems > >printing. A week later, I installed a driver on a Mac running OS 9. > >Last fall, I installed a driver for a newly installed Linux box. It has > >handled well. The kids have printed huge amounts for homework. My wife > >has printed some photos. (She's been to busy working at the kids school > >to get back to her scrapbooking.) I've printed plenty myself. > > >At about the one year mark, it ran the black toner dry. (I had about 3 > >weeks warning.) The new black toner cartridge was $65. I had no problem > >with that price since I'd been spending over $100 a year on the old > >inkjet printers. Of course the laser prints much faster, and is > >available to all the computers without my computer being in the loop. > > >As I recall, it's had only 2 real paper jams. All the others were > >cleared by my opening the top cover to look for problems. My daughter's > >laptop appears to often cause the printer to get a video underrun error, > >if she prints a PDF from within a browser window. That's strange. The > >laptop itself is pretty slow. She knows she can save the PDF locally and > >then open it with the Adobe Reader application and then print it fine. > > >Oops. I don't want to forget the price. It was $279. The only time > >since then that I've seen it that cheap was as a refurb at Fry's, where > >is was actually $180. > > IIRC, my LNCO2 was a d|i|g|i|t|a|l branded Minolta. Paul Anderson will > correct me if I am wrong. > > It's postscript and prints using a fuser oil which makes its output pages > look like magazine print. I really loved it and wish I could still use > it considering the $4K I paid for it. Alas, HP dumped it so they could > push their printers exclusively. I see no reason to retire a quality bit > of working kit and supplant it with HP kit just to bolster someone elses > retirement pension fund. I don't/won't have one so any money I save is > welcome. HP have pissed me off so in this regard that I will NEVER EVER > purchase and HP printer or any type. I even work to dissuade others from > such a purchase. > > -- > VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM > > "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" Seriously, check Ebay. If you know the Minolta model number the consumables may be available now (didn't see any under LNC02 today though). ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.278 ************************