INFO-VAX Wed, 18 Jul 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 389 Contents: Re: %DCL-W-SYMOVF, no room for symbol definitions - delete some symbols Re: %DCL-W-SYMOVF, no room for symbol definitions - delete some symbols Re: %DCL-W-SYMOVF, no room for symbol definitions - delete some symbols Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Re: Linux (was Re: How many people here use Itanium w VMS) RE: Linux (was Re: How many people here use Itanium w VMS) Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) String manipulations Re: String manipulations Re: String manipulations Re: String manipulations Re: String manipulations Re: String manipulations Re: What does GEM mean? Re: What does GEM mean? Re: What does GEM mean? Re: What does GEM mean? Re: What does GEM mean? What's up with Google - Groups today? Re: What's up with Google - Groups today? Re: What's up with Google - Groups today? Re: XML for VMS Re: XML for VMS ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 21:21:40 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: %DCL-W-SYMOVF, no room for symbol definitions - delete some symbols Message-ID: In article <1184532271.908646.316560@r34g2000hsd.googlegroups.com>, Bob Gezelter writes: > It would be interesting to look at the output of various SHOW SYMBOL > commands at various points in the processing. Could something in the > "loop" be adding symbols on occasion? Yes. I could include such commands. What do you suggest? It's really nothing complicated. It queries my router (using LYNX) whether the WAN address has changed and if so or if a certain time has past, it updates my DNS. (Another batch job resubmits this batch job if it catches, and two others watch all batch jobs, including each other, resubmitting any which crash (for whatever reason).) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 21:22:12 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: %DCL-W-SYMOVF, no room for symbol definitions - delete some symbols Message-ID: In article <469A8C51.6090702@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > How many symbols does your batch job define? Less than 10, probably. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 21:23:56 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: %DCL-W-SYMOVF, no room for symbol definitions - delete some symbols Message-ID: In article , VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > I would wager that after many days of creating and deleting DCL symbols, the > pool is too fragmented to allocate enough space to create some symbol and it > is this that is causing you to get the: That sounds logical, since the job a) runs for long times (actually, it runs forever, unless it crashes, at which time it is resubmitted) and b) doesn't define many symbols. I suppose there is nothing to do but resubmit it when it crashes (this is already done automatically). Is it more likely to run into this problem on VAX or on ALPHA? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 19:33:37 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Message-ID: In article , "Tom Linden" wrote: > On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 02:04:17 -0700, P. Sture > wrote: > > > In article <1184655667.455244.29330@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, > > dooleys@snowy.net.au wrote: > > > >> On Jul 17, 7:35 am, Neil Lowden wrote: > >> > Hi VAXman > >> > > >> > Thanks for that, what you say makes perfect sense. Do you know if this > >> > is documented anywhere? > >> > > >> > Regards > >> > > >> > -N > >> The debugger manual suggests that you don't install it > >> > >> "You do not have to install a shareable image to debug it. > >> Instead, you can debug your own private copy by assigning a logical > >> name to it." > >> > >> and > >> > >> "Define a logical name to point to the local copy of the shareable > >> image. > >> You must specify the device and directory as well as the image name." > >> > > > > In case it's not obvious from that, define it as a process logical name, > > not a system wide one, so that it's completely private. > > > define/user ? Well it would work until you forgot to issue it before a RUN. Debugging is an iterative process - run, edit, recompile, and I'd be bound to forget to do the define/user on at least one of those RUNs. -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 14:11:51 -0500 From: Jeff Subject: Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Message-ID: Neil Lowden wrote: > I came across odd behaviour with the debugger today under OpenVMS/I64 > V8.3. It distils to the following: > > COMPILE/DEBUG and LINK/DEBUG with an appropriate options file to > create a simplistic shareable image with one routine and INSTALL the > resulting image /SHARE. > > COMPILE/DEBUG and LINK/DEBUG with appropriate options a main program > against the above shareable image. The main program just calls the > routine defined in the shareable image. > > DEFINE the requisite logical name to reference the shareable image and > RUN the main program which brings up the debugger. Do a SET IMAGE and > SET MODULE for the shareable image and SET BREAK at the routine in the > shareable. Hit GO and wait for the breakpoint. After this point > multiple STEPs appear to do nothing -- source and line numbers don't > change in the debugger. Although do enough STEPs (in the dark) and > eventually you step out of the shareable back to the main program and > everything is back to normal. > > Now, don't install the shareable with /SHARE and repeat the above. The > STEPs through the shareable image behave as one would expect and show > line for line what's going on. > > Anyone else come across this or know why this only happens when the > shareable image is INSTALLed /SHARE. > > Regards > > -N > Hi Neil, I'm the project leader for OpenVMS DEBUG. I appreciate all the advice others have given you to help you understand what's going on. However, every single person is wrong! :-) All the suggestions I've read are focused on how the debugger can't set breakpoints in an installed shareable image and that you must define a logical name to point to the shareable image. This is true, but only in certain circumstances. The situation you describe is *not* one of them! In fact, by reading your description of the problem, it appears to me that the breakpoint IS being set and IS being reached. I reach this conclusion because it's the only reasonable explanation for the behavior you describe: > SET MODULE for the shareable image and SET BREAK at the routine in the > shareable. Hit GO and wait for the breakpoint. After this point > multiple STEPs appear to do nothing [...] > Although do enough STEPs (in the dark) and > eventually you step out of the shareable back to the main program and > everything is back to normal. Nowhere do you mention that the break is not reached. In fact, to the contrary, your observation that "eventually you step out of the shareable" can only be true if the original breakpoint was reached. Here is my theory for what's happening: the debugger is unable to display the source lines when you are executing in the installed shareable image. When this happens, the debugger displays the source it can find, which in this case is the source code for the *caller*. The debugger is telling you what it is doing, too: did you see the SOURCESCOPE messages? This explains why "multiple STEPs appear to do nothing" and why it looks as if you are stepping "in the dark". I cannot as yet explain WHY the debugger can't display the source lines for the code in the shareable image. That it cannot is a legitimate bug. If you would like me to look into this further, please contact your local support representative and log a problem report. Otherwise, defining a logical name (or not installing the image) are possible workarounds. Another possible workaround might be to LINK with /DSF (I have not tried this so cannot confirm it as a solution.) Thanks for your interest in OpenVMS! -Jeff Nelson -OpenVMS DEBUG Project Leader -first.last@hp.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:29:35 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Message-ID: In article , Jeff writes: > > >Neil Lowden wrote: >> I came across odd behaviour with the debugger today under OpenVMS/I64 >> V8.3. It distils to the following: >> >> COMPILE/DEBUG and LINK/DEBUG with an appropriate options file to >> create a simplistic shareable image with one routine and INSTALL the >> resulting image /SHARE. >> >> COMPILE/DEBUG and LINK/DEBUG with appropriate options a main program >> against the above shareable image. The main program just calls the >> routine defined in the shareable image. >> >> DEFINE the requisite logical name to reference the shareable image and >> RUN the main program which brings up the debugger. Do a SET IMAGE and >> SET MODULE for the shareable image and SET BREAK at the routine in the >> shareable. Hit GO and wait for the breakpoint. After this point >> multiple STEPs appear to do nothing -- source and line numbers don't >> change in the debugger. Although do enough STEPs (in the dark) and >> eventually you step out of the shareable back to the main program and >> everything is back to normal. >> >> Now, don't install the shareable with /SHARE and repeat the above. The >> STEPs through the shareable image behave as one would expect and show >> line for line what's going on. >> >> Anyone else come across this or know why this only happens when the >> shareable image is INSTALLed /SHARE. >> >> Regards >> >> -N >> > >Hi Neil, > >I'm the project leader for OpenVMS DEBUG. I appreciate all the advice >others have given you to help you understand what's going on. However, >every single person is wrong! :-) fEaGcGe Well, I did read the question at 1am in the morning after a gruelling battle with a SCSI driver in a cluster. %) >All the suggestions I've read are focused on how the debugger can't set >breakpoints in an installed shareable image and that you must define a >logical name to point to the shareable image. This is true, but only in >certain circumstances. The situation you describe is *not* one of them! Hmm. >In fact, by reading your description of the problem, it appears to me >that the breakpoint IS being set and IS being reached. I reach this >conclusion because it's the only reasonable explanation for the behavior >you describe: > > > SET MODULE for the shareable image and SET BREAK at the routine in the > > shareable. Hit GO and wait for the breakpoint. After this point > > multiple STEPs appear to do nothing [...] > > Although do enough STEPs (in the dark) and > > eventually you step out of the shareable back to the main program and > > everything is back to normal. > >Nowhere do you mention that the break is not reached. In fact, to the >contrary, your observation that "eventually you step out of the >shareable" can only be true if the original breakpoint was reached. > >Here is my theory for what's happening: the debugger is unable to >display the source lines when you are executing in the installed >shareable image. When this happens, the debugger displays the source it >can find, which in this case is the source code for the *caller*. The >debugger is telling you what it is doing, too: did you see the >SOURCESCOPE messages? This explains why "multiple STEPs appear to do >nothing" and why it looks as if you are stepping "in the dark". > >I cannot as yet explain WHY the debugger can't display the source lines >for the code in the shareable image. That it cannot is a legitimate bug. Have you seen this behavior? If so, can a SET SOURCE help remedy it? I missed tipping pints with you at the last bootcamp! -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:32:30 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Message-ID: In article , Jeff writes: > > >VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >> In article <1184620314.826911.96920@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, Neil Lowden writes: >>> Anyone else come across this or know why this only happens when the >>> shareable image is INSTALLed /SHARE. >> >> You need to modify the code to set a breakpoint. If it is shared, it >> would wreak havoc with others using the shareable when they encountered >> the modified "breakpoint" code/instruction. > >Bzzt. Wrong answer. Thanks for playing, though. :) >DEBUG has automatic mechanisms in place that avoid this problem. One of >them is to remap the page. On Integrity systems we have another trick up >our sleeves: we can use a "hardware breakpoint register". Search for >"IBR" in the Itanium Architecture manual, Vol 2. Will do. Never enough time to read through them and REALLY absorb it all. Next 'bout of insomnia (which is quite regular), I should give that a read and see if it will counter the insomnia. >The breakpoint in fact worked as it should. There is another explanation >for what's going wrong, which I describe in post > Reading... -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:35:33 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Message-ID: In article , Jeff writes: > > >VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >> In article <1184620314.826911.96920@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, Neil Lowden writes: >>> Anyone else come across this or know why this only happens when the >>> shareable image is INSTALLed /SHARE. >> >> You need to modify the code to set a breakpoint. If it is shared, it >> would wreak havoc with others using the shareable when they encountered >> the modified "breakpoint" code/instruction. > >Bzzt. Wrong answer. Thanks for playing, though. > >DEBUG has automatic mechanisms in place that avoid this problem. One of >them is to remap the page. On Integrity systems we have another trick up >our sleeves: we can use a "hardware breakpoint register". Search for >"IBR" in the Itanium Architecture manual, Vol 2. What about in (X)DELTA which I use most of the time. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" ------------------------------ Date: 17 Jul 2007 15:52:58 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Message-ID: In article , VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > > What about in (X)DELTA which I use most of the time. > Hm, haven't used DELTA for a while, isn't there a command to set all process pages modifiable? Anything XDELTA can't write can be simply be written via the console, if you don't have crash on halt enabled. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:01:09 -0500 From: Jeff Subject: Re: Debugging shareable images weirdness Message-ID: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > Well, I did read the question at 1am in the morning after a gruelling > battle with a SCSI driver in a cluster. %) Leniency will be granted. :-) > Have you seen this behavior? If so, can a SET SOURCE help remedy it? Yes, I've seen this behavior, but not exactly in this configuration. SET SOURCE/LATEST will in fact help! Thanks for pointing out the obvious. :-) > I missed tipping pints with you at the last bootcamp! I know. I am looking forward to the next time we meet. -Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 12:45:21 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: Linux (was Re: How many people here use Itanium w VMS) Message-ID: On 07/17/07 08:52, Jeffrey H. Coffield wrote: > JF Mezei wrote: >> Ron Johnson wrote: >>> Just about *every* open source app that runs in 32-bit Linux also >>> runs in the PPC64, Alpha, x86-64 & IA64 Linux. >> >> What about stuff like the Adobe reader ? Isn't Oracle now available on >> Linux ? Does Oracle provide binaries for all CPU platforms ? > > The Linux Itanium servers I sold to my customer only run Apache/Tomcat > in a DMZ. All the database are on OpenVMS on the internal network. The > customer is migrating all their desktops from MS to Linux so they have a That's very interesting. Are these narrow-focus desktops, and they've found an adequate substitute for Exchange? > great deal of experience with Linux and since their previous web servers > ran Linux, they considered that safer than running Apache/Tomcat on > OpenVMS. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:40:23 +0000 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: RE: Linux (was Re: How many people here use Itanium w VMS) Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: Ron Johnson [mailto:ron.l.johnson@cox.net] > Sent: July 17, 2007 1:45 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: Re: Linux (was Re: How many people here use Itanium w VMS) > > On 07/17/07 08:52, Jeffrey H. Coffield wrote: > > JF Mezei wrote: > >> Ron Johnson wrote: > >>> Just about *every* open source app that runs in 32-bit Linux > also > >>> runs in the PPC64, Alpha, x86-64 & IA64 Linux. > >> > >> What about stuff like the Adobe reader ? Isn't Oracle now > available on > >> Linux ? Does Oracle provide binaries for all CPU platforms ? > > > > The Linux Itanium servers I sold to my customer only run > Apache/Tomcat > > in a DMZ. All the database are on OpenVMS on the internal > network. The > > customer is migrating all their desktops from MS to Linux so they > have a > > That's very interesting. > > Are these narrow-focus desktops, and they've found an adequate > substitute for Exchange? > From a back end perspective, here is good alternative and keep whatever cli= ent you want - including Outlook): http://h71000.www7.hp.com/solutions/mail.html - Communigate Pro on OpenVMS = Integrity (or Alpha) http://www.stalker.com/content/news_article_01252005.html - Announcement pr= ess release http://www.stalker.com/content/default.html - Vendor web site Regards Kerry Main Senior Consultant HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660 Fax: 613-591-4477 kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT) OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 12:47:18 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) Message-ID: On 07/17/07 11:13, C.W.Holeman II wrote: > Bob Koehler wrote: >> emacs has had EDT keybindings for a long, long time. But not all >> keyboards have those keys. > > The keyboard keypad that I am using has a double height "+" key. Are > there keyboards that work on a PC that have the EDT keypad? Typically, KP- is emulated by Shift-grey-plus or Ctrl-grey-plus. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: 17 Jul 2007 15:48:46 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) Message-ID: In article , Ron Johnson writes: > On 07/17/07 11:13, C.W.Holeman II wrote: >> Bob Koehler wrote: >>> emacs has had EDT keybindings for a long, long time. But not all >>> keyboards have those keys. >> >> The keyboard keypad that I am using has a double height "+" key. Are >> there keyboards that work on a PC that have the EDT keypad? > > Typically, KP- is emulated by Shift-grey-plus or Ctrl-grey-plus. > Grey? All of my keys are grey (I remember Gold in EDT, and Blue in DEBUG, but not grey). And three fingered combinations are not going to let us keep up with our normal editing speeds. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:56:11 -0600 From: Keith Parris Subject: Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) Message-ID: C.W.Holeman II wrote: > The keyboard keypad that I am using has a double height "+" key. Are > there keyboards that work on a PC that have the EDT keypad? In addition to the LK461-A2 Rob mentioned (in tasteful VT220 beige) the LK46W-A2 (W in the part number is for White) I'm typing this on is also a PS/2 keyboard with EDT keypad layout. I've been successful in the past in getting all the keypad keys working with KEAterm by telling it I had an LK411-style keyboard, but I'm using PowerTerm 525 on this PC at the moment and I ended up defining a function key for Keypad-Dash as I couldn't figure out how to make the extra key work properly. The 3X-LK462-A2 is a black PS/2 keyboard with VT-style keypad layout. The 3X-LK463-A2 is a black USB keyboard with VT-style keypad layout. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 23:37:01 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: PC EDT keypad (was EDT Replacement) Message-ID: On 07/17/07 15:48, Bob Koehler wrote: > In article , Ron Johnson writes: >> On 07/17/07 11:13, C.W.Holeman II wrote: >>> Bob Koehler wrote: >>>> emacs has had EDT keybindings for a long, long time. But not all >>>> keyboards have those keys. >>> The keyboard keypad that I am using has a double height "+" key. Are >>> there keyboards that work on a PC that have the EDT keypad? >> Typically, KP- is emulated by Shift-grey-plus or Ctrl-grey-plus. >> > > Grey? All of my keys are grey (I remember Gold in EDT, and Blue in > DEBUG, but not grey). > > And three fingered combinations are not going to let us keep up with > our normal editing speeds. I'm referring to a PC-102 keyboard that accesses VMS using a terminal emulator. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 13:04:33 -0700 From: apogeusistemas@gmail.com Subject: String manipulations Message-ID: <1184702673.576481.183940@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com> Hi: Please, can you tell me how create a command procedure to get this file: vax> type file1 BANANAS: - are delicious - are expensives PINEAPPLES: - s=E3o saborosos - s=E3o deliciosos - s=E3o_exc=EAntricos vax> and get this output: vax> type file2 bananas_are delicious bananas_are expensives pineapples_s=E3o saborosos pineapples_s=E3o deliciosos pineapples_s=E3o_exc=EAntricos vax> Thanks in advance. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Jul 2007 15:33:30 -0500 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: String manipulations Message-ID: In article <1184702673.576481.183940@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, apogeusistemas@gmail.com writes: > Please, can you tell me how create a command procedure to get this > file: Using TECO, fnBANANAS: - are delicious - are expensives PINEAPPLES: - s=E3o saborosos - s=E3o deliciosos - s=E3o_exc=EAntricos $bananas_are delicious bananas_are expensives pineapples_s=E3o saborosos pineapples_s=E3o deliciosos pineapples_s=E3o_exc=EAntricos $ex$$ :-) ------------------------------ Date: 17 Jul 2007 15:57:46 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: String manipulations Message-ID: <92Uxh+a4v9mA@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <1184702673.576481.183940@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, apogeusistemas@gmail.com writes: > > Please, can you tell me how create a command procedure to get this > file: > Sure, hire one of the consultants who lurk here, pay him good money, and the procedure will be created. Or give us good reason to think you're not asking us to do your homework (job?). ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 21:07:39 GMT From: Chris Sharman Subject: Re: String manipulations Message-ID: apogeusistemas@gmail.com wrote: > Hi: > > Please, can you tell me how create a command procedure to get this > file: $ edit myproc.com ! ;-) See help lex f$loc, f$ext, read, write, open, etc. If you're going to do much of this though, another tool might perform better - someone suggested teco; more mainstream would be tpu or perl (portable). Chris > vax> type file1 > > BANANAS: > - are delicious > - are expensives > > PINEAPPLES: > - são saborosos > - são deliciosos > - são_excêntricos > > vax> > > and get this output: > vax> type file2 > > bananas_are delicious > bananas_are expensives > > pineapples_são saborosos > pineapples_são deliciosos > pineapples_são_excêntricos > vax> > > > Thanks in advance. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:45:41 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: String manipulations Message-ID: <469D62B5.9090408@comcast.net> apogeusistemas@gmail.com wrote: > Hi: > > Please, can you tell me how create a command procedure to get this > file: > > vax> type file1 > > BANANAS: > - are delicious > - are expensives > > PINEAPPLES: > - são saborosos > - são deliciosos > - são_excêntricos > > vax> > > and get this output: > vax> type file2 > > bananas_are delicious > bananas_are expensives > > pineapples_são saborosos > pineapples_são deliciosos > pineapples_são_excêntricos > vax> > > > Thanks in advance. > Awwww...... Are you finding your homework a little too difficult? I will be happy to supply a solution for $50 US, IN ADVANCE! Or you could just type HELP LEXICAL F$LOCATE, HELP LEXICAL F$EXTRACT, HELP LEXICAL F$EDIT, etc. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:21:21 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: String manipulations Message-ID: apogeusistemas@gmail.com wrote: > and get this output: > vax> type file2 > > bananas_are delicious > bananas_are expensives > > pineapples_são saborosos > pineapples_são deliciosos > pineapples_são_excêntricos $HELP LEXICAL F$EXTRACT $HELP LEXICAL F$ELEMENT $HELP LEXICAL F$EDIT $OPEN/READ infile file1.txt $OPEN/WRITE outfile file2.txt $LOOP: $READ/END=endloop infile buffer use f$element to see if element 0 is blank. the loop with f$element to extract each word in the string, and append it with a "_" before it to your output buffer. When done, you write the output buffer. $ENDLOOP: $CLOSE infile $CLOSE outfile ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 15:29:06 -0400 From: John Reagan Subject: Re: What does GEM mean? Message-ID: Tom Linden wrote: > On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 08:35:49 -0700, Neil Rieck > wrote: VCG was > Digital's > effort to do essentially the same and they did have at one time PL/I, > Pascal, > SCAN, C, Pearl and Coral66. VAX Pascal never used the VCG. V1 came from University of Washington and was basically the CDC 6400 code generator "forced" to generate VAX code. VAX Pascal V2 and beyond use a Digital-written code generated using a few designs from CMU (PQCC and Cattell's (now at Sun) Maximal Munching Method). Those designs were carried over and expanded into GEM's code generator. VAXELN Pascal used the VCG. -- John Reagan OpenVMS Pascal/Macro-32/COBOL Project Leader Hewlett-Packard Company ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:58:58 -0400 From: John Reagan Subject: Re: What does GEM mean? Message-ID: FredK wrote: > I found this an interesting read: > > > http://www.valuesearchfunds.com/userFiles/Essay_Oct_2005.pdf > Awesome! BTW, Rich Grove recently retired from Intel and compilers after 35 or so years in the business. The strength of our compilers is a direct result of Rich's engineering skills and passing them onto the rest of us. -- John Reagan OpenVMS Pascal/Macro-32/COBOL Project Leader Hewlett-Packard Company ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 23:36:40 -0400 From: "Neil Rieck" Subject: Re: What does GEM mean? Message-ID: <469d7e7c$0$16393$88260bb3@free.teranews.com> "Larry Kilgallen" wrote in message news:lQYKqMzTBQN8@eisner.encompasserve.org... > In article <1184686549.609123.60580@g37g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Neil > Rieck writes: > >> I've already killed an hour today and haven't been able to find out >> what the letters in GEM mean? Anyone out there know? > > What reason do you have to believe it is an acronym ? > The letters were all upper case? > > I thought it was conceived about the time people were code naming things > according to precious stones. Opal ? That makes sense. But I'm glad I asked; the article referenced in my question was from a book titled "Itanium® Architecture for Programmers: Understanding 64-Bit Processors and EPIC Principles" which you can preview here: http://safari.oreilly.com/0131013726/ch11lev1sec1#snippet Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge, Ontario, Canada. http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/ -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:55:53 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: What does GEM mean? Message-ID: On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 12:29:06 -0700, John Reagan wrote: > Tom Linden wrote: >> On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 08:35:49 -0700, Neil Rieck >> wrote: > VCG was >> Digital's >> effort to do essentially the same and they did have at one time PL/I, >> Pascal, >> SCAN, C, Pearl and Coral66. > > VAX Pascal never used the VCG. V1 came from University of Washington > and was basically the CDC 6400 code generator "forced" to generate VAX > code. VAX Pascal V2 and beyond use a Digital-written code generated > using a few designs from CMU (PQCC and Cattell's (now at Sun) Maximal > Munching Method). Those designs were carried over and expanded into > GEM's code generator. > > VAXELN Pascal used the VCG. > I guess my assertion is never-the-less correct. The CDC code generator was written by a couple of guys, who moved from Boston area to Sunnyvale and was based on our backend, which had been written for the IBM series 1. Not sure what V1 was, VCG was certainly an independently developed original design. -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 21:34:37 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: What does GEM mean? Message-ID: On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 14:19:24 -0700, FredK wrote: > > "John Reagan" wrote in message > news:f7j5dh$9b3$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com... >> Tom Linden wrote: >>> On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 08:35:49 -0700, Neil Rieck >>> wrote: >> VCG was >>> Digital's >>> effort to do essentially the same and they did have at one time PL/I, >>> Pascal, >>> SCAN, C, Pearl and Coral66. >> >> VAX Pascal never used the VCG. V1 came from University of Washington >> and >> was basically the CDC 6400 code generator "forced" to generate VAX code. >> VAX Pascal V2 and beyond use a Digital-written code generated using a >> few >> designs from CMU (PQCC and Cattell's (now at Sun) Maximal Munching >> Method). Those designs were carried over and expanded into GEM's code >> generator. >> >> VAXELN Pascal used the VCG. >> >> > > I found this an interesting read: > When I get a chance I will fill in the rest of the story. Schwartzman was working at Prime in the language group when he got Ankcorn to found LPI. He gave LPI a contract to write Cobol for Prime, IIRC. But Schwartzman was the real founder of LPI. He had a license to use our compilers and in fact he built all his compiler using the technology that Freiburghouse had inovated. Had this happened today he might have ended up in jail. I believe that he worked at DEC before he joined Prime, and Ankcorn was at Wang. Notwithstanding his self-serving essay, I did collect considerable sums from him some years later in a lawsuit for using technology he didn't own and his investors threw him out of the business. The Pascal they built I think came from Prime, but this was so long ago that I may be mistaken. Incidentrally Ankcorn built a code generator using the Graham-Hammer pattern matching stuff, clearly misguided, this was not production level capable. > > http://www.valuesearchfunds.com/userFiles/Essay_Oct_2005.pdf > > > > -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:32:01 -0400 From: "Neil Rieck" Subject: What's up with Google - Groups today? Message-ID: <469d1af6$0$10194$88260bb3@free.teranews.com> What's up with Google - Groups today (07.07.17) ??? http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.vms It's now been unavailable for more than 6 hours. Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge, Ontario, Canada. http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/ -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 19:58:27 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: What's up with Google - Groups today? Message-ID: <469D65B3.B04872D2@spam.comcast.net> Neil Rieck wrote: > > What's up with Google - Groups today (07.07.17) ??? > http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.vms > It's now been unavailable for more than 6 hours. Available and current as of 19:57 US-CDT (00:58z) -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 23:28:46 -0400 From: "Neil Rieck" Subject: Re: What's up with Google - Groups today? Message-ID: <469d7ca2$0$4189$88260bb3@free.teranews.com> "David J Dachtera" wrote in message news:469D65B3.B04872D2@spam.comcast.net... > Neil Rieck wrote: >> >> What's up with Google - Groups today (07.07.17) ??? >> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.vms >> It's now been unavailable for more than 6 hours. > > Available and current as of 19:57 US-CDT (00:58z) > But they must have had some serious problems. For example, all the "GEM stuff" from today is missing. Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge, Ontario, Canada. http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/ -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 07:10:11 +0800 From: Tim Sneddon Subject: Re: XML for VMS Message-ID: <469bef24$0$16270$88260bb3@free.teranews.com> Pierre wrote: > > you may notice an extra source (snprintf.c) in the build procedure > I took it from http://www.ijs.si/software/snprintf/ to be able to > built xmlstarlet as my C compiler complained on some missing > functions. I think that depend on the DECC version. snprintf() is available on more recent versions of VMS. I think I spotted it in either V8.2 or V8.3. Regards, Tim. -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 15:23:16 -0500 (CDT) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: XML for VMS Message-ID: <07071715231616_202003EE@antinode.org> From: Tim Sneddon > Pierre wrote: > > > > you may notice an extra source (snprintf.c) in the build procedure > > I took it from http://www.ijs.si/software/snprintf/ to be able to > > built xmlstarlet as my C compiler complained on some missing > > functions. I think that depend on the DECC version. > > snprintf() is available on more recent versions of VMS. I think I > spotted it in either V8.2 or V8.3. __CRTL_VER, not __DECC_VER. STDIO.H: [...] #if __CRTL_VER >= 70312000 int snprintf(char *__s, __size_t __n, const char *__format, ...); int vsnprintf(char *__s, __size_t __n, const char *__format, __va_list __ap); #endif [...] Looks like V7.3(-x?) with an ECO. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.389 ************************