INFO-VAX Wed, 31 Jan 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 62 Contents: Re: An opening for VMS: licence management disk crash, DBMS database error? Re: Disk space problem Re: Disk space problem Re: ECP and TDC on Integrity, VMS v8.2-1 Re: Hobbyists passing through Oklahoma City? Re: Hobbyists passing through Oklahoma City? Re: How long to really setup a VMS system ? Re: How long to really setup a VMS system ? Re: How long to really setup a VMS system ? Re: How to get the codec from a file ? Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Re: Mozilla: "edit" as helper application ? Re: PL/I for Itanium Re: PL/I for Itanium Re: PL/I for Itanium Re: PL/I for Itanium Re: PL/I for Itanium Re: PRODUCT INSTALL question Re: Purging across nodes deletes the only version of a file Re: Purging across nodes deletes the only version of a file Re: Purveyor CGI mailbox capacity [bit long winded] Re: Purveyor CGI mailbox capacity [bit long winded] Question about patching Re: Question about patching RMS Journaling Performance Re: SYS$CLUSTER_NODE_FULLNAME not defined Re: VMS installation trick vms users in toronto canada Re: vms users in toronto canada ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 31 Jan 2007 07:12:28 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: An opening for VMS: licence management Message-ID: In article , Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: > In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: >> In article , helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes: >>> In article <8c159$45bf2201$cef8887a$13298@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei >>> writes: >>> >>>> Definitely. But the point is that Microsoft is now embarking on a witch >>>> hunt wantijng to audit business customer sites and threathen to charge for >>>> any illegal license. >>> >>> Whatever one thinks of Microsoft, one can't fault them for legally >>> attacking people who are stealing from them. >> >> No, but suing your customers isn't a great way to expand your >> markets. > > Not all of us are interested in having Microsoft expand their markets. Sounds like my original post. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 04:20:58 -0800 From: "jhjr4381" Subject: disk crash, DBMS database error? Message-ID: <1170246052.234782.266070@s48g2000cws.googlegroups.com> I have been contacted by a Manman Dec customer site desperate for help. They are not Camus members but I would like to try and help them out. They are running a Microvax 3100, VMS 5.5, DBMS 5.1, Manman 8.4 (yes there are still some out there). It seems that they had a disk crash on the disk holding their databases. They have replaced the disk and done a restore and Manman opens up ok. They can run reports and lists however whenever they run a transaction that writes data they whole system hangs. The only option they have then is to switch the system off and back on again. There is no obvious error in the Operator.log nor does the Manman report SY R 130 show anything. When the command hangs there is no error as it stops it the middle of writing the data. I am guessing that this may be a database error but as far as I can tell there is no obvious problem there (DBO/DUMP shows no corrupt pages etc). = Anybody had a similar problem or any suggestions..... ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 07:24:07 -0800 From: "tadamsmar" Subject: Re: Disk space problem Message-ID: <1170257047.202247.320880@q2g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> On Jan 30, 3:43 pm, "tadamsmar" wrote: > On Jan 30, 3:08 pm, "John Wallace" > wrote: > > > > > > > "folks on this newsgroup said the AXP 150 is picky about the disks it will > > run." > > > Well if we're being picky :) It's not so much a problem with the AXP150 > > itself as with whichever SCSI adapter card it's got, and with the finicky > > nature of SCSI cabling in general (and in particular, SCSI termination). The > > SCSI card is likely to be an Adaptec AHA1742A (an EISA card) but iirc in an > > Alpha these came with DEC-specific firmware. A wide variety of disks from > > the relevant era and a few years thereafter are likely to appear to work, > > which might be an option if you can lay your hands on a couple, but given > > that you are using shadowing, you might wish to stick to things which had > > DEC part numbers which had been qualified for VMS on the Jensen (aka DECpc > > AXP/150, aka DEC 2000 Model 300) rather than using widely available > > "generic" SCSI drives. Your choice. > > > Hth > > John Wallace > > We tried the disk that came with one of our AlphStation 400s and never > got it to work. > > How do I find a qualified, bigger disk drive?- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - If I cannot find a bigger disk that works, I am going to surplus this AXP 150 since we can no longer run our application on it, at least not without creating a special oddball environment and I don't want to deal with that. They tell me it will probably end up being sold in a lot with a bunch of PCs if I surplus it. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 09:00:45 -0800 From: "tadamsmar" Subject: Re: Disk space problem Message-ID: <1170262844.253476.267910@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com> On Jan 31, 10:24 am, "tadamsmar" wrote: > On Jan 30, 3:43 pm, "tadamsmar" wrote: > > > > > > > On Jan 30, 3:08 pm, "John Wallace" > > wrote: > > > > "folks on this newsgroup said the AXP 150 is picky about the disks it will > > > run." > > > > Well if we're being picky :) It's not so much a problem with the AXP150 > > > itself as with whichever SCSI adapter card it's got, and with the finicky > > > nature of SCSI cabling in general (and in particular, SCSI termination). The > > > SCSI card is likely to be an Adaptec AHA1742A (an EISA card) but iirc in an > > > Alpha these came with DEC-specific firmware. A wide variety of disks from > > > the relevant era and a few years thereafter are likely to appear to work, > > > which might be an option if you can lay your hands on a couple, but given > > > that you are using shadowing, you might wish to stick to things which had > > > DEC part numbers which had been qualified for VMS on the Jensen (aka DECpc > > > AXP/150, aka DEC 2000 Model 300) rather than using widely available > > > "generic" SCSI drives. Your choice. > > > > Hth > > > John Wallace > > > We tried the disk that came with one of our AlphStation 400s and never > > got it to work. > > > How do I find a qualified, bigger disk drive?- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text - > > If I cannot find a bigger disk that works, I am going to surplus this > AXP 150 since we can no longer run our application on it, at least not > without creating a special oddball environment and I don't want to > deal with that. > > They tell me it will probably end up being sold in a lot with a bunch > of PCs if I surplus it.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - Someone emailed me with the following info: The AXP 150 is not listed as supported by 7.3.2: http://h18000.www1.hp.com/info/SP2501/SP2501PF.PDF And, we have the RZ26 which is the largest disk listed in the AXP 150 specifications: http://h18002.www1.hp.com/alphaserver/download/dec2000_ug.pdf Oddly enough, I have been running 7.3.2 on this box, but not in production. Could be the disk space limitations are what precludes 7.3.2. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 01:36:34 -0800 From: "Ian Miller" Subject: Re: ECP and TDC on Integrity, VMS v8.2-1 Message-ID: <1170236193.991591.77760@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> I think you need ECP V5.6A ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:08:30 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Hobbyists passing through Oklahoma City? Message-ID: <9166$45c0bf04$cef8887a$8433@TEKSAVVY.COM> Tad Winters wrote: > Are there any OpenVMS hobbyists (or wannabes) even passing through Oklahoma > City in the next couple of weeks? I have FREE hardware available!! > If you don't want to email me, at least respond here. You might wish to describe what hardware would be available to pickup. This might interest some further away who would be willing to pay for shipping. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 16:21:17 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: Hobbyists passing through Oklahoma City? Message-ID: JF Mezei wrote in news:9166$45c0bf04$cef8887a$8433@TEKSAVVY.COM: > Tad Winters wrote: >> Are there any OpenVMS hobbyists (or wannabes) even passing through >> Oklahoma City in the next couple of weeks? I have FREE hardware >> available!! If you don't want to email me, at least respond here. > > You might wish to describe what hardware would be available to pickup. > This might interest some further away who would be willing to pay for > shipping. > Shipping is not a possibility. The hardware must be picked up. If it was up to me, I'd ship it, or rather keep it for myself. However, I'm just arranging for its pickup, since I'm in Oregon. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 07:21:19 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: How long to really setup a VMS system ? Message-ID: In article , Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: > > If those logging on to production systems are the programmers who > wrote the production applications, how do you know they did not > introduce a trojan horse ? If a programmer was to write a trojan horse, why would he write it to require his own login? If you don't KNOW the content and quality of your programmer's software then you have a serious business risk. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 15:39:48 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: How long to really setup a VMS system ? Message-ID: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote in news:VuzmlC33NMpO@eisner.encompasserve.org: > In article , > Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: >> >> If those logging on to production systems are the programmers who >> wrote the production applications, how do you know they did not >> introduce a trojan horse ? > > If a programmer was to write a trojan horse, why would he write it > to require his own login? > > If you don't KNOW the content and quality of your programmer's > software then you have a serious business risk. > I'd have to agree. In my experience, management's approach has been to separate the development system from the production system in order to maintain the security of the source code. I suspect that's because the VP of IT was a programmer in that company at one time. Although many of the programmers lacked understanding of the security (and most of the features) of VMS, they seemed to be less likely to try to damage to the company than some of the production workers. (That may be because they were well compensated, and production workers generally received raises based on "productivity.") ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 10:41:11 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: How long to really setup a VMS system ? Message-ID: In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article , Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: >> >> If those logging on to production systems are the programmers who >> wrote the production applications, how do you know they did not >> introduce a trojan horse ? > > If a programmer was to write a trojan horse, why would he write it > to require his own login? If a programmer writes a trojan horse to expose data within the confines of a machine to which she (or confederates) have no access, there is no problem. > If you don't KNOW the content and quality of your programmer's > software then you have a serious business risk. Total knowledge is difficult, and high level controls are an effective second line of defense. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 17:57:38 +0100 From: "Klaus-D. Bohn" Subject: Re: How to get the codec from a file ? Message-ID: <45b8e183$0$22651$9b622d9e@news.freenet.de> Sorry, but this is not enough for me. For me is more important wich characterset has the file. I need these information. Look for this examples: iso8859_1 koi8_r cp1258 johab_hangul and so on. "Jean-François Piéronne" schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:45b79971$0$19668$426a74cc@news.free.fr... > I have a python script (from Jason Petron) which do something like that: > > $ python magic.py FOO.ZIP > FOO.ZIP: application/zip > $ python magic.py foo.exe > foo.exe: VMS Alpha executable > > Currently 854 file types are known. > > JF ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 01:53:07 -0800 From: "Dave Gullen" Subject: Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Message-ID: <1170237187.563460.146110@q2g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> HSG old? We are migrating from DSSI to HSD10 for one of our customers. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 04:35:00 -0800 From: "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" Subject: Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Message-ID: <1170246900.220333.256140@v33g2000cwv.googlegroups.com> On Jan 30, 8:42 pm, "Malcolm Dunnett" wrote: > Stupid question I'm sure, but is there any way to get HSZTERM > to work on an Integrity Server (binary translation of the EXE? > source available anywhere? ). > > Anyone within HP know if it would be giving away any trade secrets > to release the source code ( or is it built in some obscure language? ) > > If not is there anything that can talk to HSG80s through VMS 8.x > on Integrity? 1) Set host to Alpha system in connected to same HSG and run HSZterm 2) Use reverse telnet (or lat) through a Decserver connected to the terminal line on the HSG. I just checked "$HELP SET HOST" on an Itanium 8.3. Lots of choices, including a useless /HSC, but /HSZ did not magically appear. Hein. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 17:13:15 +0100 From: Paul Sture Subject: Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Message-ID: In article <1170246900.220333.256140@v33g2000cwv.googlegroups.com>, "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" wrote: > On Jan 30, 8:42 pm, "Malcolm Dunnett" > wrote: > > Stupid question I'm sure, but is there any way to get HSZTERM > > to work on an Integrity Server (binary translation of the EXE? > > source available anywhere? ). > > > > Anyone within HP know if it would be giving away any trade secrets > > to release the source code ( or is it built in some obscure language? ) > > > > If not is there anything that can talk to HSG80s through VMS 8.x > > on Integrity? > > 1) Set host to Alpha system in connected to same HSG and run HSZterm > > 2) Use reverse telnet (or lat) through a Decserver connected to the > terminal line on the HSG. > > I just checked "$HELP SET HOST" on an Itanium 8.3. > Lots of choices, including a useless /HSC, but /HSZ did not magically > appear. > IIRC, installing the HSZTERM kit on an Alpha enables "$ SET HOST/SCSI", and that is what is used. -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:30:04 -0800 From: "Malcolm Dunnett" Subject: Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Message-ID: <45c0c407$1@flight> "David J Dachtera" wrote in message news:45BFFE94.17335307@spam.comcast.net... > > Is this a hobbyist system? HSGs being as aged as they are it's hard for me > to > get my mind around the idea of using them in production, except as a > transition > to MSA, EVA or XP12K or - *GASP* - Symmetrix (Heresy! Sacrilege! Grab your > torch > and pitchfork!) > No, it's a production system. HSGs may be old but they work very well and they're dirt cheap ( check out the eBay listings ). Of course the SCSI peformance isn't up to current standards and they're only 1gbit fibrechannel, but you can still get a lot of work done with them. If you use them in the "new style" boxes you can still get current SCSI drives for them (it's getting hard to find the "blue bricks" for the BA370 boxes though). I don't pay support on them I just pick up a good supply of spares and do self-maintenance. Of course I haven't had to do much other than change the batteries on them - they're pretty solid. (ps I rebuild the battery packs when they expire, the Hawker Cyclon cells they use are readily available at any good battery supplier). I've got all the mission critical data HBVS shadowed across pairs of HSG80 arrays that are located at opposite ends of the campus ( what I call "mini disaster tolerance"). I could never afford to do all that with current generation kit. I've looked at MSAs but the last time I checked they're weren't all that well thought of ( do they do active/active controller mode yet? ). EVAs and up are well out of our price range, even looking at the eBay listings for them. I did get a call the other day from an EMC sales type :-) note to Sue: If you ever want to do a story about running an organization on other peoples cast-off DEC/Compaq/HP gear give me a call (maybe do the "eveready bunny" angle? ) > -- > David J Dachtera > dba DJE Systems > http://www.djesys.com/ > > Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page > http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ > > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ > > Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: > http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ > > Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: > http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:35:58 -0800 From: "Malcolm Dunnett" Subject: Re: HSZTerm for Integrity? Message-ID: <45c0c569$1@flight> "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" wrote in message news:1170246900.220333.256140@v33g2000cwv.googlegroups.com... >> If not is there anything that can talk to HSG80s through VMS 8.x >> on Integrity? > > 1) Set host to Alpha system in connected to same HSG and run HSZterm > That's what I'm doing at the moment. I have an ES40 in the cluster and it's connected into the SAN fabric. > 2) Use reverse telnet (or lat) through a Decserver connected to the > terminal line on the HSG. Possible, but inelegant. I'd rather not have to maintain Decservers just for that purpose. > > I just checked "$HELP SET HOST" on an Itanium 8.3. True, but do a "set host/scsi" and see what you get (Itanium 8.3): %DCL-W-ACTIMAGE, error activating image HSZTERM$SCSIPAD -CLI-E-IMAGEFNF, image file not found DSA5:[SYS1.SYSCOMMON.][SYSEXE]HSZTERM$SCSIPAD.EXE; Still a vestige of support hanging around in the DCLTABLES. Is the protocol for talking to the GG device documented anywhere? It shouldn't be too hard to write a PAD program to talk to it (assuming it's not terribly arcane). ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 09:09:50 +0100 From: huber@NIRWANA-mppmu.mpg.de (Joseph Huber) Subject: Re: Mozilla: "edit" as helper application ? Message-ID: <5ljBQxaYO6wK@vms.mppmu.mpg.de> In article <2588b$45c03775$cef8887a$29186@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei writes: > Ok, I have figured out that when a web site insists on sending an image as > a useless application/octet-stream, I can force it to execute > /appl/xv/xv.exe and it will open that file with XV. > (appl is a logical name on my system) > So, this points to an actual image which is then probably invoked as a > foreign command. > Is there a trick to tell Mozilla to accept "edit" as a command so it would > use my default editor (TPU in decwindows mode) ? > If I enter a DCL command, it complains because it cannot find that file. Mozilla expects a file specification in Unix syntax, either an image or a command file. Put the EDIT/INTERFACE=DECW in a .COM file, and put this file into the application definition like /appl/com/edit_for_mozilla.com . And be aware, Mozilla passes the filename to be edited as P2 to the command file. Use something like this: $! Mozilla passes p1=procedure name, p2=/tmp/filename $ if p2 .eqs. "" then exit $ unix_to_vms 'p2 $ file = p2 $ if vms_filename .nes. "" then file = vms_filename $ set default sys$scratch: $ EDIT/INTERFACE=DECWINDOWS 'file' where unix_to_vms is a program to translate the Unix file-specification to VMS in symbol vms_filename, since Edit does not understand Unix syntax. Find one of these programs in http://wwwvms.mppmu.mpg.de/~huber/util/main/unix_to_vms.C -- Joseph Huber , Muenchen,Germany: http://www.huber-joseph.de/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:02:15 -0800 From: glen herrmannsfeldt Subject: Re: PL/I for Itanium Message-ID: Tom Linden wrote: (snip on Fortran and PL/I) > It is aliasing that makes optimization more of a challenge. That, too, but there are a lot of PL/I features that didn't exist in Fortran 66 or even Fortran 77 that do tend to result in slower code. Mostly the also result in slower code in Fortran 90 or newer. Dynamic storage tends to have at least one more level of indirection than static storage. Also, some subscript calculation optimizations can't be done when they are not known at compile time. In most cases I believe it is a fair trade, though. -- glen ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 06:16:51 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: PL/I for Itanium Message-ID: In article , glen herrmannsfeldt writes: > Tom Linden wrote: > > (snip on Fortran and PL/I) > >> It is aliasing that makes optimization more of a challenge. > > That, too, but there are a lot of PL/I features that > didn't exist in Fortran 66 or even Fortran 77 that do tend > to result in slower code. Mostly the also result in slower > code in Fortran 90 or newer. > > Dynamic storage tends to have at least one more level of > indirection than static storage. Also, some subscript > calculation optimizations can't be done when they are not > known at compile time. In most cases I believe it is > a fair trade, though. I have not studied how well particular compilers (for any language with such dynamic features) work, but in general one should avoid using fancy features to give the compiler maximum chance to optimize. Personally, I am not at all hesitant to use fancy features on portions of my code that get exercised once per image activation. For core loops I am much more fussy, except when they access disk. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 07:27:07 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: PL/I for Itanium Message-ID: <8QnnGzl$5GjZ@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <45bfec1e$0$49205$14726298@news.sunsite.dk>, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= writes: > > Try go into a job advertising web site in the country where > you live and look up number of jobs for various programming > languages. The number of open jobs is not a measurement of the amount of work being done since a lot of people working in other languages are already stabily employed. You don't have to hire C programmers if you already have them. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 15:49:16 +0100 From: Paul Sture Subject: Re: PL/I for Itanium Message-ID: In article , Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote: > In article , glen > herrmannsfeldt writes: > > Tom Linden wrote: > > > > (snip on Fortran and PL/I) > > > >> It is aliasing that makes optimization more of a challenge. > > > > That, too, but there are a lot of PL/I features that > > didn't exist in Fortran 66 or even Fortran 77 that do tend > > to result in slower code. Mostly the also result in slower > > code in Fortran 90 or newer. > > > > Dynamic storage tends to have at least one more level of > > indirection than static storage. Also, some subscript > > calculation optimizations can't be done when they are not > > known at compile time. In most cases I believe it is > > a fair trade, though. > > I have not studied how well particular compilers (for any language > with such dynamic features) work, but in general one should avoid > using fancy features to give the compiler maximum chance to optimize. > > Personally, I am not at all hesitant to use fancy features on portions > of my code that get exercised once per image activation. For core loops > I am much more fussy, except when they access disk. Here's an example of a 70% performance improvement: http://preview.tinyurl.com/3xlgrd --- quote --- Newsgroups: comp.os.vms From: Shane.F.Smith Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 11:32:16 -0700 Subject: Re: VMS BASIC and IP Performance Question I can confirm that from experience, although you don't actually have to MAP the string to get the performance. I've seen 70% performance improvements out of replacing heavy dynamic string usage with MID$ to do the changes in a pre-extended string. Of course, your mileage will vary greatly. -- end quote --- -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 19:40:14 +0100 From: Paul Sture Subject: Re: PL/I for Itanium Message-ID: In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote: > In article , Michael Kraemer > writes: > > > > Define "widely used". > > I never saw somebody use ADA for any purpose on Unix, > > let alone embedded systems. > > Doesn't mean that there aren't people out there actually > > using it, but again, it depends where you live. > > I know of a lot of use of Ada in embedded sysems. Absolutely no > Java or C# there. Mostly C, C++, and assembly. > > Yes, I suppose somebody, somewhere, may have tried Java or C# or > anything else in embedded systems. I've seen Fortran, PL/I, just > about everything except COBOL tried in embedded systems. I'd take > Fortran-95 or PL/I over Java for embedded systems any day, and I > haven't seen a vendor offering C# for embedded systems unless you > think Microsoft really does embedded systems. To quote from the O'Reilly "Practical C Programming" book. Chapter 1 - "What is C?": "Which is better, C or C++? The answer depends on who you talk to. C++ does great things for you behind your back, such as automatically calling constructors and destructors for variables. This processing makes some types of programming easy, but it makes static checking of programs difficult, and you need to be able to tell exactly what your program is doing if you are working on embedded control applications. So some people consider C++ the better language because it does things automatically and C doesn't. Other people consider C better for precisely the same reason." According to that philosophy, C# is a non-starter for embedded systems. Naturally I have to add to the last sentence of the above quote that yet others consider Ada, Fortran, PL/I etc better than C. :-) -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 04:42:54 -0800 From: "tadamsmar" Subject: Re: PRODUCT INSTALL question Message-ID: <1170247374.474471.204870@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com> On Jan 30, 4:51 pm, p...@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOeGER) wrote: > In article <1170172242.963938.161...@v45g2000cwv.googlegroups.com>, "tadamsmar" writes: > > >I have the PCSI$COMPRESSED file for the 7.3.2 UPDATE V9 patch. > > Good. > > >Is there any way to extract specific patches from that? > > No (supported) way. But/Because there is no need for it, because an UPDATE > ECO is (usually) a collection of (previously published) ECOs which are (or > were) all available separately (sometimes UPDATE contain more than the > collection of these ECOs and then I can understand why a few people want > to disbandle the UPDATE ECO ;-). If you can no longer find it on ITRC > drop me a line and I dig in my directories if I still have it... > > > For > >instance, can I pull out the TDF V3 patch and just apply that one? > > TDF V3 is part of UPDATE, but was already replaced by TDF V4 in Aug06 > which is also part of UPDATE. Why do you insist on TDF V3? > Do you confuse TDF and TZ ECOs? TZ V3 came after UPDATE 9 in Dec06 and > requires UPDATE 9 and you would therefor need both of them... You are right that I can't just install TDF V3. I'd need to at least install UPGRADE V5 with it. Nevermind... > > > Or > >do I have to go get the specific patch from the vms web site? > > If you can't install an UPDATE ECO, consider a VMS upgrade ;-) > > >I can't find a way to do only a specific patch using product install. > > ?? > > PRODUCT INSTALL is it, just for every other ECO/product. You need the > right kit file of course. > > >My Alphas are not on the WWW so I have to go through some rigamarole > >to get the patch in place. > > One of us can send it (zipped) per mail if you like (and if your mailserver > has no rigorous size limit of course) if you like... > > -- > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER > Network and OpenVMS system specialist > E-mail p...@langstoeger.at > A-1030 VIENNA AUSTRIA I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 06:05:03 -0800 From: "Martyn.Pattison@gmail.com" Subject: Re: Purging across nodes deletes the only version of a file Message-ID: <1170252303.271029.85410@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> On 28 Jan, 20:03, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote: > IIRCPURGEis not supported across DECnet, but DELETE is. Or maybe > that is out of date. Well HELP would suggest otherwise: Avpct1=BB help purge PURGE . . . PURGE Subtopic? example PURGE Examples . . . 6.$ PURGE/KEEP=3D2 TAMPA::DISK1:[EXAMPLE]*.LIS The PURGE command in this example deletes all but the two highest numbered versions of each file with the file type .LIS in the directory EXAMPLE on remote node TAMPA. I've got a call open with HP for this now, so when I get a response I'll update this thread for posterity. Thanks all, Martyn ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:02:48 -0500 From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: Purging across nodes deletes the only version of a file Message-ID: "Martyn.Pattison@gmail.com" wrote on 01/31/= 2007 09:05:03 AM: > On 28 Jan, 20:03, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob > Koehler) wrote: > > > > IIRCPURGEis not supported across DECnet, but DELETE is. Or mayb= e > > that is out of date. > > Well HELP would suggest otherwise: > > Avpct1=BB help purge > > PURGE > . > . > . > PURGE Subtopic? example > > PURGE > > Examples > . > . > . > 6.$ PURGE/KEEP=3D2 TAMPA::DISK1:[EXAMPLE]*.LIS > > The PURGE command in this example deletes all but the two > highest numbered versions of each file with the file > type .LIS > in the directory EXAMPLE on remote node TAMPA. > > > I've got a call open with HP for this now, so when I get a response > I'll update this thread for posterity. > Actually, it's not DECNet, but Searchlists that are causing your proble= m. They do not always behave as one would want. Another example is when you mount a tape with the system account and execute a DIRECTORY *.* command, the default is DIRECTORY SYS$LOGIN:*.*= which is a searchlist of sys$specific:[sysmgr], sys$common:[sysmgr] and the result is two passes at the tape and a double-listing of the files on it. As was stated in an earlier post, be careful of searchlist defaults and how you use them. > Thanks all, > > Martyn >= ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 04:46:37 -0800 From: bob@instantwhip.com Subject: Re: Purveyor CGI mailbox capacity [bit long winded] Message-ID: <1170247597.180999.194300@a34g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> On Jan 31, 1:32 am, Mark Daniel wrote: > b...@instantwhip.com wrote: > > poll about what? We want to use it and obviously someone else > > Excuse me. On a second reading I think I see your question. What am I > polling the c.o.v. community about? > > >> I'm guessing there are no undocumented work-arounds for Purveyor and > >> this issue but thought I might poll the community > > For any (un)documented ways of changing the Purveyor behaviour from an > unconditional carriage-control massage for *all* "text/.." content-type > responses. > > >> before abandoning it altogether. > > Writing Purveyor out of soyMAIL. I am not keen to have users cursing > the application when it is the underlying server platform causing the > problem (for any given set of issues of course). no one is cursing the app, they are asking for a fix ... so now you are saying you can't fix it? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2007 02:28:48 +1030 From: Mark Daniel Subject: Re: Purveyor CGI mailbox capacity [bit long winded] Message-ID: <12s1fa5o9nrqeb4@corp.supernews.com> bob@instantwhip.com wrote: > On Jan 31, 1:32 am, Mark Daniel wrote: > >>b...@instantwhip.com wrote: >> >>>poll about what? We want to use it and obviously someone else >> >>Excuse me. On a second reading I think I see your question. What am I >>polling the c.o.v. community about? >> >> >>>>I'm guessing there are no undocumented work-arounds for Purveyor and >>>>this issue but thought I might poll the community >> >>For any (un)documented ways of changing the Purveyor behaviour from an >>unconditional carriage-control massage for *all* "text/.." content-type >>responses. >> >> >>>>before abandoning it altogether. >> >>Writing Purveyor out of soyMAIL. I am not keen to have users cursing >>the application when it is the underlying server platform causing the >>problem (for any given set of issues of course). > > > no one is cursing the app, they are asking for a fix ... so now you > are saying > you can't fix it? [The hyperbole arcs off into the void completely missing it's mark yet again. Now for the bathos.] Indeed! But they have observed the application broken under certain, indeterminate circumstances. They have asked for a fix. What has been said, is that in this respect, it's not soyMAIL that is broken. It's the underlying server platform corrupting the IPC between application and client. I was asking the Purveyor community, as represented by the subset that might happen to lurk in or about c.o.v., if anyone knew of a work-around to fix this aberrant Purveyor behaviour. Without a workaround or a fix from PSC there is nothing soyMAIL can do about this particular issue. Yes, I am saying I cannot fix it; Purveyor. On a separate but related topic; when do users start to actually curse an application I wonder? All software has bugs, some known, some unknown. The known can often be worked around. The unknown occasionally surface and bite. Others unknown continue to remain that way. (Hell, I'm sounding like D. Rumsfeld here.) All software has limitations (except Emacs of course). However, a known problem that surfaces occasionally, potentially subtly, perhaps superficically undetectably, altering data presented to the user - where is the point that becomes unacceptable? Knowing it's going to occur one in a thousand uses? One in a hundred? In twenty? At what point does annoyance and resignation become voluble cursing? On another separate but related note; I have spent perhaps a dozen hours chasing a couple of reported soyMAIL issues that turn out to be the result of Purveyor adding inappropriate carriage-control. I would have rather spent that time on something else. Although I may now have a heads-up for any future reports that smack of the same characteristics the starting point for resolving any future Purveyor-based issues is going to be eliminating this behaviour as a factor. I can't realistically afford to do that either, not at least for two - probably soon to be one - sites. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 04:57:03 -0800 From: "issinoho" Subject: Question about patching Message-ID: <1170248223.171519.35300@s48g2000cws.googlegroups.com> Following the instructions linked from the Java pages to install Manadatory Rating 1 ECOs, 1. In Step 1, choose operating system 2. In Step 2, type 'Install_1' as the keyword 3. In Step 3, change the search criteria to 'exact phrase'. 4. In Step 4, click on the search button to start the search 5. Click on the patch name in the results to view the 'Patch Details' page that contains the release notes, or proceed... 6. Check the box(es) to the left of the patch name in the results and click 'add to selected patch list' button 7. On the 'selected patch list' page, click 'download selected' button 8. On the 'download patches' page, you can download patches in one operation or individually and also via anonymous ftp(1) or http. Make your selection to complete the download This is all fine, except that I notice in the list of patches there are a dozen individual ECOs and at the bottom a consolidated ECO set for my version of VMS (8.2) My question is: do I install all the individual patches *AND* the consolidated patch set; or just the individual patches; or just the consolidated set? Please advise. Thanks. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 06:22:54 -0800 From: "Ian Miller" Subject: Re: Question about patching Message-ID: <1170253374.443912.129800@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> the master eco text file will tell you what is in the consolidated ECO kit (UPDATE) and what is not If everything you want is in the UPDATE kit then just install that. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:42:33 -0500 From: "Hal Kuff" Subject: RMS Journaling Performance Message-ID: Hi, anyone have some comments about the performance impact of RMS Journaling assu,ing no i/o throughput issues on the journaling disks? And anyone have any issues with Journaling critical files in their experience? ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 05:40:08 -0800 From: "Galen" Subject: Re: SYS$CLUSTER_NODE_FULLNAME not defined Message-ID: <1170250808.688815.235850@k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> Paul, > $ mcr ncl flush session control naming cache entry "*" This didn't seem to have any effect. After running it, as expected I couldn't see the remote node in the CDI cache (run sys $system:cdi_cache_dump) But with CDI$TRACE I could see that it was still hanging up when it tried to resolve the remote node's name. CDI$TRACE also told me that SYS$CLUSTER_NODE_FULLNAME wasn't defined. Once I defined it correctly, the problem went away. That's why I'm what defines SYS$CLUSTER_NODE_FULLNAME. Restarting DECnet doesn't do it. Galen ------------------------------ Date: 28 Jan 2007 10:07:22 +0100 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOeGER) Subject: Re: VMS installation trick Message-ID: <45bc75da$1@news.langstoeger.at> In article , moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) writes: >I knew how to do this for a while, but perhaps many here will find this >trick useful. > >Let's say you have a "new" Alpha box with a severely limited hardware >configuration, such as a DS10L from Island Computer or something. >It has exactly one (blank) hard drive, maybe a CD-ROM, or maybe not. >This is common hobbyist situation, due to the cheap (or even free!) >DS10Ls available from Island or elsewhere. > >Let's say that you also have a VMScluster already (can be a 1 node cluster) >but you want the new node to run a different version of VMS than the >cluster or something. (say the cluster is running V8.2 and you want to >install V8.3 on the new node) You have the installation kit on a spare >drive in the cluster, but you don't have a second spare drive there. >You don't want the new node to be part of the cluster, at least not >permanently. The spare disk with the installation kit is a SCSI disk, >but you can't connect the SCSI drive to the DS10L either because the one >PCI slot is occupied, or you simply don't have a spare PCI SCSI adapter. >How to get VMS onto the new drive? Well one way is to boot as a satellite >and clone the cluster's system disk onto the new system's drive, but like >I said, let's say you want to install a new version from scratch. To >do that you boot from the installation kit disk. But it's in the wrong >spot. Also, the VMS on the installation kit is configured standalone. > >Well, here's a trick, you can actually boot a cluster version of the >installation kit by temporarily booting the system from the installation >kit as a cluster node. Unsupported, of course. Here's how. You could also use the Infoserver software on OpenVMS Alpha and serve the VMS installation CD from the cluster Alpha to the then standalone system and do a fresh VMS install via infoserver as mentioned in the installation manual. But don't ask me how, I've still a real InfoServer ;-) -- Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER Network and OpenVMS system specialist E-mail peter@langstoeger.at A-1030 VIENNA AUSTRIA I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 09:04:13 -0800 From: "rexdale1050@yahoo.ca" Subject: vms users in toronto canada Message-ID: <1170263053.707682.234270@a34g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> my company is using open vms. we upgraded from vax to alphaserver ds 10 to operated my business for over 25 years. i would like to contact vms users in toronto canada. to help keep vms strong and healthy in canada with mutual vms tips and supplies. thank you neil ------------------------------ Date: 31 Jan 2007 09:28:39 -0800 From: "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" Subject: Re: vms users in toronto canada Message-ID: <1170264518.963064.309830@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> On Jan 31, 12:04 pm, "rexdale1...@yahoo.ca" wrote: : > i would like to contact vms users in toronto canada. > to help keep vms strong and healthy in canada with mutual vms tips and supplies. : Be sure to visit the "Encompass Canada Technical Seminars" on 1/20/2007 http://www.encompasscanada.com/seminars.htm Hein. ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.062 ************************